UK woman arrested for silently praying across from abortion clinic

[rogue06]

I think this is a classic case where there was far more emphasis on the letter of the law rather than the spirit of the law.

It smacks of the TSA at airports rousting granny out of her wheelchair to search her because she might be a terrorist about to board a flight.

It seems like some are deliberately misusing the law as a club to silence any opposition -- even when that opposition IS already silent.

[Cow Poke]

It seems like some are deliberately misusing the law as a club to silence any opposition -- even when that opposition IS already silent.

The law appears to be prejudicially written - in the States, it would almost certainly be struck down as unconstitutional. Or, more likely, never enacted in the first place. But, then again, we're moving in that direction.

[Hypatia_Alexandria]

And yet Josephus writes of where his body was then entombed.

Does he? Where? In book XI of Antiquities he writes of Alexander allegedly being shown the Book of Daniel but makes no mention of a tomb.

[Diogenes]

Why?

I fail to see any connection between a literary figure in a Jewish apocalyptic text and an established historical individual.

What next? A "critique" of Jean Valjean perhaps?

The martyrdom of Hypatia is a myth. If you wish to deny the historicity of Daniel, surely you similarly question the works of say Plutarch. Contemporaneous accounts in the ancient world are exceedingly rare. But again, the historicity of Daniel is immaterial to his relevance.

[RumTumTugger]

And yet Josephus writes of where his body was then entombed.

Oh dear it looks like we got caught in HAs attempt at hijacking the thread again.

[rogue06]

Does he? Where? In book XI of Antiquities he writes of Alexander allegedly being shown the Book of Daniel but makes no mention of a tomb.

Several sources, including our good buddies at Wikipedia say

The 1st century Jewish writer Josephus reported that Daniel's body lay in a tower in Ecbatana in Parthia, alongside the bodies of the kings of the Medes and Persians; later Jewish authorities said he was buried in Susa

which appears to cite Noegel, Scott B.; Wheeler, Brannon M. (2002). Historical Dictionary of Prophets in Islam and Judaism but don't bother saying where in Josephus this is mentioned.

Without a specific citation I'm willing to withdraw the statement until a quote can be found.

[Hypatia_Alexandria]

The martyrdom of Hypatia is a myth.

If you apply the word in its original Greek then in her life she bore witness to her Neoplatonist beliefs. Her murder is another issue.

If you wish to deny the historicity of Daniel, surely you similarly question the works of say Plutarch.

Why?

Contemporaneous accounts in the ancient world are exceedingly rare.

Are they?

But again, the historicity of Daniel is immaterial to his relevance.

It is not "his relevance" but the relevance of that particular work within Judaism [and later in Christianity] as it has come down to us.

Was Jonah really swallowed by a great fish? Or was the character merely a figure in an allegory intended to inculcate tolerance? In the final verses of the last chapter we are shown that Yahweh's magnanimity extends even to the residents of Nineveh and their animals.

[Hypatia_Alexandria]

Several sources, including our good buddies at Wikipedia say

The 1st century Jewish writer Josephus reported that Daniel's body lay in a tower in Ecbatana in Parthia, alongside the bodies of the kings of the Medes and Persians; later Jewish authorities said he was buried in Susa

which appears to cite Noegel, Scott B.; Wheeler, Brannon M. (2002). Historical Dictionary of Prophets in Islam and Judaism but don't bother saying where in Josephus this is mentioned.

Without a specific citation I'm willing to withdraw the statement until a quote can be found.

All of which leaves me wondering why you initially made this rather emphatic statement:

And yet Josephus writes of where his body was then entombed.

[Hypatia_Alexandria]

Oh dear it looks like we got caught in HAs attempt at hijacking the thread again.

Writes the lady who wanted citations on the historicity of the figure of Daniel.

[Diogenes]

If you apply the word in its original Greek then in her life she bore witness to her Neoplatonist beliefs.

What is the referent of "the word in its original Greek". For someone who is peculiar regarding language, you have language issues yourself.

Her murder is another issue.

Which is the precisely why she is brought up.

It is not "his relevance" but the relevance of that particular work within Judaism [and later in Christianity] as it has come down to us.

The work details his life. The relevance of the work is similarly immaterial to its or Daniel's historicity.

Was Jonah really swallowed by a great fish? Or was the character merely a figure in an allegory intended to inculcate tolerance? In the final verses of the last chapter we are shown that Yahweh's magnanimity extends even to the residents of Nineveh and their animals.

Assuming a deity exists, Jonah's story is not incredulous. Again, the historicity is immaterial to the derived orthopraxis or the willingness of Yahweh to have mercy on even those hated as much as the residents of Nineveh. The greater lesson is learned regarding Jonah's unwillingness to forgive the Ninevites and his desire to see their destruction despite God's willingness to have mercy, not only on the Ninevites, but Jonah as well.

[Diogenes]

Assuming a deity exists, Jonah's story is not incredulous. Again, the historicity is immaterial to the derived orthopraxis or the willingness of Yahweh to have mercy on even those hated as much as the residents of Nineveh. The greater lesson is learned regarding Jonah's unwillingness to forgive the Ninevites and his desire to see their destruction despite God's willingness to have mercy, not only on the Ninevites, but Jonah as well.

I assume this renew questions regarding my agnosticism but why would a Christian say that the historicity of Biblical accounts is "immaterial".



Of course, the historicity of Daniel was merely a derailment, perhaps to distance away from silent prayer being considered protesting and thus criminalising thought.

[RumTumTugger]

Writes the lady who wanted citations on the historicity of the figure of Daniel.

No just someone who realized she almost got caught by one of your trolls. Since the we weren't talking about history but about theology, which Diogenes understood when tried to lead you back to the discussion at hand which you refuse to go back to.

My suggestion to the others in this thread is to ignore HA's arguments about history and get back to the political ,social and theological ramifications of enacting thought control hate crime laws such as the one in the op.

[Cow Poke]

I assume this renew questions regarding my agnosticism but why would a Christian say that the historicity of Biblical accounts is "immaterial".

But, if you think about it, H_A vehemently defended the pervert in Ohio exposing himself to small children, until she finally decided to question whether it actually happened or not.

Though it did, in fact happen, it's actually immaterial, because she stubbornly defended a pervert exposing himself to small children, whether it was a hypothetical or actual account.

And, I state again - it actually happened.

[NorrinRadd]

Several sources, including our good buddies at Wikipedia say

The 1st century Jewish writer Josephus reported that Daniel's body lay in a tower in Ecbatana in Parthia, alongside the bodies of the kings of the Medes and Persians; later Jewish authorities said he was buried in Susa

which appears to cite Noegel, Scott B.; Wheeler, Brannon M. (2002). Historical Dictionary of Prophets in Islam and Judaism but don't bother saying where in Josephus this is mentioned.

Without a specific citation I'm willing to withdraw the statement until a quote can be found.

Brill Online excerpts "Daniel, Tomb of," from the Encyclopedia of Jews in the Islamic World, but again the portion of the quote showing the specific Josephus citation is dropped and pay-walled.

[eider]

Thought being criminalised within a certain area is still criminalising thought.

Oh dear......... Where I live (England) if you have got slapped with any kind of an Anti-Social-Behaviour-Order (ASBO) then it is because of your Behaviour!
......like approaching within a set distance of a venue the likes of which you have previously been a nuisance at.