Originally posted by Sparko
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It's Confirmed, Men Are Pigs!
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Originally posted by Sam View PostThat's a factor of novelty. If you knew, walking out on any given day, that you might have three to ten people wolf-whistle and catcall, would it still make your day? If you knew, instinctively or from experience, that any of those verbal solicitations might be followed by physical intimidation, harassment, or assault, would you still feel great about the first catcall?
I think this sort of statement is only possible to make from the safety of not having experienced catcalling on a daily or even weekly basis.
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Originally posted by Psychic Missile View PostI do know and she knows. They say hello to her because she's attractive. They are not striking up a conversation. They are cat calling. Cat calling is harassment.I DENOUNCE DONALD J. TRUMP AND ALL HIS IMMORAL ACTS.
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Originally posted by Catholicity View Postby the way, its polite to wave or say hello in the south. Cat calls are unacceptable, and if you greet a woman in a "cat call manner" whose a victim of sexual harrassment, you'll get kicked in the nuts. FYI
http://www.salon.com/2014/08/13/man_...op_catcallers/
"As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them. O my people, they which lead thee cause thee to err, and destroy the way of thy paths." Isaiah 3:12
There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.
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Catcalling is just a particularly uncivilized expression of the male imperative to pursue women (since the opposite will simply never happen to most of them, they have to be proactive in finding a mate). Those who pointed out that women only find it "harassment" if the guy isn't attractive to them are right. In this particular case the woman in question appears to be racist and classist since most of the men talking to her are lower class blacks.
And I should probably take this chance to point out that people are not all that honest about what they like. See Emma Watson and the derision she received for her hypocrisy in a recent UN speech:
"As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them. O my people, they which lead thee cause thee to err, and destroy the way of thy paths." Isaiah 3:12
There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.
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Originally posted by Psychic Missile View PostI do know and she knows. They say hello to her because she's attractive. They are not striking up a conversation. They are cat calling. Cat calling is harassment.
Puh-leeze.
So greeting a girl you don't find attractive would not be cat-calling?
You are showing yourself to be a sexist pig. I hope you realize that.
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Originally posted by Sparko View Postoh my you are such a sensitive guy! I bet all the girls love you.
Puh-leeze.
So greeting a girl you don't find attractive would not be cat-calling?
You are showing yourself to be a sexist pig. I hope you realize that.
While we can identify a spectrum between saying 'Hello, looking good today Charlene" all the way up to "Hey baby, want a ride? Yeah bend over I'll ride you home." It doesn't mean that you never cross a line. Since we like agree on that, the question is where to draw the line? Communication can't be it, waving and saying hi still too little, looks and glances shouldn't be a problem... oogling and starring, that's obviously starting to be unwelcome, walking up to a woman on the street complimenting the size of her breasts and how erotic she appears, that's just not right.
What do you think Sparko?
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Originally posted by Leonhard View PostI think psychic_missile is overactively defending the right position, but I don't think he's wrong in his approach. Married men have no reason giving sexually implicit compliments to other women than their wife. Bachelors ought to be gentlemen and strike up a conversation, and have reasonable confidence that the woman is interested their advances.
While we can identify a spectrum between saying 'Hello, looking good today Charlene" all the way up to "Hey baby, want a ride? Yeah bend over I'll ride you home." It doesn't mean that you never cross a line. Since we like agree on that, the question is where to draw the line? Communication can't be it, waving and saying hi still too little, looks and glances shouldn't be a problem... oogling and starring, that's obviously starting to be unwelcome, walking up to a woman on the street complimenting the size of her breasts and how erotic she appears, that's just not right.
What do you think Sparko?I DENOUNCE DONALD J. TRUMP AND ALL HIS IMMORAL ACTS.
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Originally posted by Leonhard View PostI think psychic_missile is overactively defending the right position, but I don't think he's wrong in his approach. Married men have no reason giving sexually implicit compliments to other women than their wife. Bachelors ought to be gentlemen and strike up a conversation, and have reasonable confidence that the woman is interested their advances.
While we can identify a spectrum between saying 'Hello, looking good today Charlene" all the way up to "Hey baby, want a ride? Yeah bend over I'll ride you home." It doesn't mean that you never cross a line. Since we like agree on that, the question is where to draw the line? Communication can't be it, waving and saying hi still too little, looks and glances shouldn't be a problem... oogling and starring, that's obviously starting to be unwelcome, walking up to a woman on the street complimenting the size of her breasts and how erotic she appears, that's just not right.
What do you think Sparko?
The guys that were sitting on the side of the street just shouting comments at her like "Looking good!" and "Damn!" and so on, were doing what is called cat-calling and could be harassment.
I noticed that most of those were young black guys, and I think it is mostly about showing off for their buddies on the street, trying to act "macho"
Watch this video:
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Originally posted by Zymologist View PostI can agree with all this; I'm more confused by the apparent conclusion that talking to a woman at all is harassment. At least Sam and PM have both seemed to say that even saying hi is harassment.
I haven't seen Psychic Missile arguing that simple hellos constitute harassment, either."I wonder about the trees. / Why do we wish to bear / Forever the noise of these / More than another noise / Robert Frost, "The Sound of Trees"
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Originally posted by Psychic Missile View PostSparko and Bill, do you think those people saying "hello" were egalitarian with their greeting, or do you think they reserved it for women they find attractive?That's what
- She
Without a clear-cut definition of sin, morality becomes a mere argument over the best way to train animals
- Manya the Holy Szin (The Quintara Marathon)
I may not be as old as dirt, but me and dirt are starting to have an awful lot in common
- Stephen R. Donaldson
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Originally posted by Psychic Missile View PostI do know and she knows.Jorgeer, PM...?
They say hello to her because she's attractive.
They are not striking up a conversation.
They are cat calling.
Cat calling is harassment.That's what
- She
Without a clear-cut definition of sin, morality becomes a mere argument over the best way to train animals
- Manya the Holy Szin (The Quintara Marathon)
I may not be as old as dirt, but me and dirt are starting to have an awful lot in common
- Stephen R. Donaldson
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Originally posted by Sam View PostNo, dude. I haven't said anything like that. I have said that people who are taking offense at this video because they think women should react differently to someone saying hello and someone explicitly objectifying or harassing them need to understand that the environment of harassment makes any unsolicited greeting from a stranger suspect. So the argument, heard by some here and elsewhere, that women need to just understand the difference between a catcall and a sincere greeting misses the point of public places as a hostile environment for women.
I haven't seen Psychic Missile arguing that simple hellos constitute harassment, either.
Originally posted by Sam View PostVirtually none of what's shown in this video is acceptable. It's very diminishing and often enough outright threatening.
Originally posted by Psychic Missile View PostJust FYI , I know in a lot of places greetings are common. In NYC, that number of greetings and comments would take a man a lifetime to reach. It's not friendliness, it's cat calling.Originally posted by Sam View PostAnd I believe that's what might be getting missed by the folks making the argument that a lot of this is just polite hellos. Given that the problem of catcalling and "street harassment" is so common, a woman cannot necessarily take even a polite hello at face value — just like that man who followed this woman for five minutes illustrates, there's always a real risk that a "polite hello" is just as much a solicitation as an explicit catcall. And when women are faced with a culture of catcalling, it forces a change in public behavior. Even in places where friendly hellos are common in public (I haven't noticed too much difference between the South and Northern Midwest in this aspect), the prevalence of harassment in public places makes such pleasantries a real threat to women.
Originally posted by Psychic Missile View PostSparko and Bill, do you think those people saying "hello" were egalitarian with their greeting, or do you think they reserved it for women they find attractive?Originally posted by Psychic Missile View PostI do know and she knows. They say hello to her because she's attractive. They are not striking up a conversation. They are cat calling. Cat calling is harassment.
So sorry if I misunderstood, but I hope you can see why I thought that. You guys appeared to, repeatedly, classify a simple greeting as either a form of harassment, or something that should be treated as harassment.
I've got no issue at all with what you've said about cat calling; I find that juvenile, disrespectful, and just pretty dumb all around.Last edited by Zymologist; 10-31-2014, 01:27 PM.I DENOUNCE DONALD J. TRUMP AND ALL HIS IMMORAL ACTS.
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Oh this is most amusing. Now the video is getting bashed that there is an excessive amount of Latinos and Blacks, heheheheheh. And it's a good point as well. Especially in light that Whites ARE still the majority ethnicity in New York City.
http://www.businessinsider.com/the-p...ampaign=bufferLadino, Guatemalan, Hispanic, and Latin, but foremostly, Christian.
As of the 1st of December, 2020, officially anointed as this:
"Seinfeld had its Soup Nazi. Tweb has its Taco Nazi." - Rogue06 , https://theologyweb.com/campus/forum...e3#post1210559
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Originally posted by Andius View PostOh this is most amusing. Now the video is getting bashed that there is an excessive amount of Latinos and Blacks, heheheheheh. And it's a good point as well. Especially in light that Whites ARE still the majority ethnicity in New York City.
http://www.businessinsider.com/the-p...ampaign=bufferMore specifically, it’s a video of a young white woman who is harassed by mostly black and Latino men as she walks around New York City for ten hours.Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s
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