Anti-Semitism Awareness Act?

[Ronson]

In 1941 Germany's neighbouring countries were under Nazi occupation. However, do not overlook the USA's quotas on Jewish immigrants in the 1930s.

Well, then stepping out one nation further. And I know, the U.S. had some peculiar antisemitic attitudes back then.

[Cerebrum123]

I think that would be Unconstitutional.

It is.

[Hypatia_Alexandria]

Well, then stepping out one nation further.

Britain or Sweden would be the nearest unoccupied countries in Europe in 1941.

And I know, the U.S. had some peculiar antisemitic attitudes back then.

It still has.

[rogue06]

Britain or Sweden would be the nearest unoccupied countries in Europe in 1941.

The "historian" forgets about Switzerland and the large section of France that the Germans didn't occupy. And let's not forget Italy either.

[rogue06]

It still has.

We've been seeing them front and center for several weeks.

[Hypatia_Alexandria]

The "historian" forgets about Switzerland and the large section of France that the Germans didn't occupy. And let's not forget Italy either.

I did indeed omit Switzerland.

However, Vichy France was hardly benign towards Jews and participated willingly in deportations. Furthermore, by 1942 Germany took the Free Zone in southern France into more direct control, I am surprised that as such a fan of Casablanca you do not recall Renault's comment about having his orders and Rick's quip about Gestapo spank! As for Italy it was one of the Axis powers so was hardly somewhere Jews would have fled in 1941.

[rogue06]

I did indeed omit Switzerland.

However, Vichy France was hardly benign towards Jews and participated willingly in deportations.

The discussion is in regards to which countries were "occupied" by the Germans in 1941. Vichy France was not occupied.

Furthermore, by 1942 Germany took the Free Zone in southern France into more direct control

The discussion is in regards to which countries were "occupied" by the Germans in 1941. 1942 is not 1941.

I am surprised that as such a fan of Casablanca you do not recall Renault's comment about having his orders and Rick's quip about Gestapo spank! As for Italy it was one of the Axis powers so was hardly somewhere Jews would have fled in 1941.

The discussion is in regards to which countries were "occupied" by the Germans in 1941. Italy was not occupied by the Germans (until later). Further, Italy was never too keen on persecuting the Jews like the Germans were doing. To be sure they passed some odious legislation in the '30s but nobody was being shipped off to concentration camps until 1943, after Italy surrendered and Germany took over large sections of the country.

The Holocaust in Italy

The Holocaust in Italy was the persecution, deportation, and murder of Jews between 1943 and 1945 in the Italian Social Republic, the part of the Kingdom of Italy occupied by Nazi Germany after the Italian surrender on 8 September 1943, during World War II.

One of the first actions that the Italian government took against Italian Jews began in 1938 with the enactment of the Racial Laws of segregation by the fascist regime of Benito Mussolini. These laws stripped away many basic human rights of the Italian Jewish citizens, with Jewish children not being allowed to go to school and Jews forbidden from marrying outside their cultural heritage. Before the Italian surrender in 1943, however, Italy and the Italian occupation zones in Greece, France and Yugoslavia had comparatively been places of relative safety for local Jews and European Jewish refugees. This changed in September 1943, when German forces occupied the country, installed the puppet state of the Italian Social Republic and immediately began persecuting and deporting the Jews found there. Of the population of 38,994 Italian Jews, 7,172 were arrested and became victims of the Shoah. By the war's end, 31,822 Jews remained in the country, having managed to evade deportation while remaining in Italy.^[1] The Italian police and Fascist militia played an integral role as the Germans' accessories.

So our resident self-proclaimed "academic historian" didn't get much right here, did she?

You claimed that Germany occupied all the countries they bordered by 1941 but somehow managed to miss Switzerland, Italy and Vichy France. IIRC, Switzerland and Italy alone share nearly 900 miles of border with Germany. That's getting close to twice the distance between Berlin and London, or the distance between Berlin and Moscow.

You also were unaware that the Jews fared far better in Italy and areas that they controlled than they did where Germany was in charge. And you are again having your problem keeping dates straight.

Maybe you should read an actual history book rather than getting your information from watching movies.

ETA: Just checked on something that was bothering me and found that, as I suspected, Liechtenstein was also not occupied during WWII

Liechtenstein: World War II

Though Nazi Germany did have plans for the annexation of Liechtenstein, primarily Operation Tannenbaum, these were never implemented and Liechtenstein's neutrality was not violated during the war.

So that's yet another country the historian didn't know about.

[Hypatia_Alexandria]

The discussion is in regards to which countries were "occupied" by the Germans in 1941. Vichy France was not occupied.

The original comment was from Ronson

Imagine him saying this in 1941 about Germany's neighboring countries refusing to take in Jews

What followed was a perfectly pleasant albeit brief exchange between us.

The discussion is in regards to which countries were "occupied" by the Germans in 1941. 1942 is not 1941.


The discussion is in regards to which countries were "occupied" by the Germans in 1941. Italy was not occupied by the Germans (until later). Further, Italy was never too keen on persecuting the Jews like the Germans were doing. To be sure they passed some odious legislation in the '30s but nobody was being shipped off to concentration camps until 1943, after Italy surrendered and Germany took over large sections of the country.

The Holocaust in Italy

The Holocaust in Italy was the persecution, deportation, and murder of Jews between 1943 and 1945 in the Italian Social Republic, the part of the Kingdom of Italy occupied by Nazi Germany after the Italian surrender on 8 September 1943, during World War II.

One of the first actions that the Italian government took against Italian Jews began in 1938 with the enactment of the Racial Laws of segregation by the fascist regime of Benito Mussolini. These laws stripped away many basic human rights of the Italian Jewish citizens, with Jewish children not being allowed to go to school and Jews forbidden from marrying outside their cultural heritage. Before the Italian surrender in 1943, however, Italy and the Italian occupation zones in Greece, France and Yugoslavia had comparatively been places of relative safety for local Jews and European Jewish refugees. This changed in September 1943, when German forces occupied the country, installed the puppet state of the Italian Social Republic and immediately began persecuting and deporting the Jews found there. Of the population of 38,994 Italian Jews, 7,172 were arrested and became victims of the Shoah. By the war's end, 31,822 Jews remained in the country, having managed to evade deportation while remaining in Italy.^[1] The Italian police and Fascist militia played an integral role as the Germans' accessories.

So our resident self-proclaimed "academic historian" didn't get much right here, did she?

You claimed that Germany occupied all the countries they bordered by 1941 but somehow managed to miss Switzerland, Italy and Vichy France. IIRC, Switzerland and Italy alone share nearly 900 miles of border with Germany. That's getting close to twice the distance between Berlin and London, or the distance between Berlin and Moscow.

You also were unaware that the Jews fared far better in Italy and areas that they controlled than they did where Germany was in charge. And you are again having your problem keeping dates straight.

Maybe you should read an actual history book rather than getting your information from watching movies.

ETA: Just checked on something that was bothering me and found that, as I suspected, Liechtenstein was also not occupied during WWII

Liechtenstein: World War II

Though Nazi Germany did have plans for the annexation of Liechtenstein, primarily Operation Tannenbaum, these were never implemented and Liechtenstein's neutrality was not violated during the war.

So that's yet another country the historian didn't know about.

I see you have spent a merry hour or so Googling your favourite academic resource.

[seanD]

Well, they are using the definition of ant-semitism listed here. In doing this, they are making certain beliefs illegal. I heavily disagree with these beliefs, but I don't think they should be illegal.

I haven't looked at the details of the bill, but base on the commentary, this is really looking like the left's version of "hate speech," only slightly modified to not look leftist.