Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria
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Fascism and Critical Race Theory
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Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View PostHow do you know that it [the label] is not right?
Or are you just referring to these phrases being used as pejoratives by some towards the opposition?
Let's say I am complaining about <Actions 1,2,3,4,5>. I am calling them all <Label A>. You, come in, and say that <Label A> means <X> and I don't know what I'm talking about. <Label A> doesn't apply in this context, <Label A> is a figment of my imagination and I am just calling things I don't like <Label A>.
If, for the sake of argument, you are correct <Label A> is applied incorrectly. It does not mean <Actions 1,2,3,4,5> are not happening. It does not mean that <Actions 1,2,3,4,5> are not real concerns. What tends to happen is that someone gets so obsessed with the definition of <Label A> that they then dismiss the very real <Actions 1,2,3,4,5> that are happening.
In other words:
"Just because the label is inaccurate, it does not mean the underlying issue they are trying to label isn't there. It just means that the label they are using isn't right."
I have explained that in as clear a language as possible, and broken it down as cleanly as possible. If you have trouble understanding it at this point, I can not and will not continue helping you to understand.
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Originally posted by CivilDiscourse View Post
I'll give one more answer on this, at which point I'm done with this rabbit hole.
Let's say I am complaining about <Actions 1,2,3,4,5>. I am calling them all <Label A>. You, come in, and say that <Label A> means <X> and I don't know what I'm talking about. <Label A> doesn't apply in this context, <Label A> is a figment of my imagination and I am just calling things I don't like <Label A>.
If, for the sake of argument, you are correct <Label A> is applied incorrectly. It does not mean <Actions 1,2,3,4,5> are not happening. It does not mean that <Actions 1,2,3,4,5> are not real concerns. What tends to happen is that someone gets so obsessed with the definition of <Label A> that they then dismiss the very real <Actions 1,2,3,4,5> that are happening.
In other words:
"Just because the label is inaccurate, it does not mean the underlying issue they are trying to label isn't there. It just means that the label they are using isn't right."
I have explained that in as clear a language as possible, and broken it down as cleanly as possible. If you have trouble understanding it at this point, I can not and will not continue helping you to understand."It ain't necessarily so
The things that you're liable
To read in the Bible
It ain't necessarily so."
Sportin' Life
Porgy & Bess, DuBose Heyward, George & Ira Gershwin
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Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post
So what are these underlying issues?
Get out, or make a good faith effort to explain what the point is, I don't care which.
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Originally posted by CivilDiscourse View Post
I'm done explaining. You apparently are either trolling, or too stupid to understand it even when its broken down to its most fundamental level. Either way, I'm done with this line of conversation. You are no longer welcome in this thread unless you can give a good faith effort at actually explaining the point I've made.
Get out, or make a good faith effort to explain what the point is, I don't care which.
Facism and Critical Race Theory are two labels that get thrown around alot. The left asserted Trump was fascist, his administration was fascist, and his supporters were fascist. The right assails the use of CRT in schools, pushed in peoples faces, etc. Both sides are told that their label is BS, and that they don't know what they are talking about.
There's one problem with that "Your label is wrong" dismissal.
Just because the label is inaccurate, it does not mean the underlying issue they are trying to label isn't there. It just means that the label they are using isn't right. The problems underneath that people are labeling still exist, and dismissing them because they aren't labeled correctly don't solve anything. They just ignore the problem, which then can get worse.
As far as I can deduce from what you have written there you are pointing out that each side calls the other names while alleging their opponents' "label is BS".
You wrote "Just because the label is inaccurate, it does not mean the underlying issue they are trying to label isn't there". What are these underlying issues "they are trying to label"? You have not identified any.
"It ain't necessarily so
The things that you're liable
To read in the Bible
It ain't necessarily so."
Sportin' Life
Porgy & Bess, DuBose Heyward, George & Ira Gershwin
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Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post
Your OP stated this;
Facism and Critical Race Theory are two labels that get thrown around alot. The left asserted Trump was fascist, his administration was fascist, and his supporters were fascist. The right assails the use of CRT in schools, pushed in peoples faces, etc. Both sides are told that their label is BS, and that they don't know what they are talking about.
There's one problem with that "Your label is wrong" dismissal.
Just because the label is inaccurate, it does not mean the underlying issue they are trying to label isn't there. It just means that the label they are using isn't right. The problems underneath that people are labeling still exist, and dismissing them because they aren't labeled correctly don't solve anything. They just ignore the problem, which then can get worse.
As far as I can deduce from what you have written there you are pointing out that each side calls the other names while alleging their opponents' "label is BS".
You wrote "Just because the label is inaccurate, it does not mean the underlying issue they are trying to label isn't there". What are these underlying issues "they are trying to label"? You have not identified any.
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Originally posted by Sparko View Post
Teaching children that whites are oppressors and blacks are victims, that racism is systemic and all the fault of white people. That "whiteness" is a disease and any arguments to the contrary is a symptom of the blindness of whites to their inherent racism.
"It ain't necessarily so
The things that you're liable
To read in the Bible
It ain't necessarily so."
Sportin' Life
Porgy & Bess, DuBose Heyward, George & Ira Gershwin
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Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View PostYet are not those precisely the sort of comments that those on the opposite side would define as "BS" and allege that someone making them didn't "know what they are talking about"?
I'm always still in trouble again
"You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
"Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
"Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman
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Originally posted by rogue06 View PostOnly by remaining willfully ignorant or dishonest."It ain't necessarily so
The things that you're liable
To read in the Bible
It ain't necessarily so."
Sportin' Life
Porgy & Bess, DuBose Heyward, George & Ira Gershwin
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Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View PostYet are not those precisely the sort of comments that those on the opposite side would define as "BS" and allege that someone making them didn't "know what they are talking about"?
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Originally posted by Ronson View PostJust an aside, nobody seems to know what "fascist" means. By definition, it has such a narrow set of attributes that the label can't be placed on anyone in recent decades.
What is racism? Look at what the political left is doing and what they're accusing the political right of.
What is white privilege? Look at what the political left is doing and what they're accusing the political right of.
What is fascism? Look at what the political left is doing and what they're accusing the political right of...
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Originally posted by Sparko View Post
CD's point is that we should be discussing those ideas rather than arguing about labels.
Originally posted by Sparko View PostBut Starlight and other liberals argue "that isn't CRT!" rather than address the issues themselves.
And that would appear to be precisely the criticism that, in his OP, CivilDiscourse directed against both sides."It ain't necessarily so
The things that you're liable
To read in the Bible
It ain't necessarily so."
Sportin' Life
Porgy & Bess, DuBose Heyward, George & Ira Gershwin
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Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View PostHow are we to deduce that what you wrote would not be dismissed as "BS" and that you would be charged with the accusation that you "don't know what" you "are talking about"?.
Do you not see the irony in that remark? Without each side specifying exactly what they understand these terms to mean, all that is left is people making abusive remarks or over-simplified generalisations to one another.
And that would appear to be precisely the criticism that, in his OP, CivilDiscourse directed against both sides.
Leave the thread now. Do not reply, do not pass go. This is offficial
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Originally posted by seanD View Post
Democrats happily urging large tech corporations to censor their political opposition is the quintessential definition of fascism, at least according to Mussolini...
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Originally posted by Ronson View Post
That's one characteristic of fascism. Another is nationalism, which Democrats (mostly globalists) don't really qualify.
It pretty much had to do something considering how it was whipped and kicked out of everywhere except for Spain where form of it lasted until Franco's death[1] three decades later.
1. Chevy Chase will be delighted to know that he remains so.
I'm always still in trouble again
"You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
"Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
"Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman
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