14-year-old Texas boy arrested for bringing homemade clock

[Cow Poke]

Yeah, that's an ethnic aspect.

You had specifically said race, Sam.

And ethnic - An ethnic group or ethnicity is a socially defined category of people who identify with each other based on common ancestral, social, cultural or national experience.

[Sam]

Their name is a huge clue - we really have no idea what their "race" is. The name has to do with their religion, not their race or country of origin.

Actually ... names have a lot more to do with country of origin than religion. I've got a friend with an Irish last name but he ain't Roman Catholic ... or Protestant, for that matter.

[Sea of red]

Their name is a huge clue - we really have no idea what their "race" is. The name has to do with their religion, not their race or country of origin.

Take a look at a picture of the kid and stop pretending you can't see the basis for the paranoia.

[Teallaura]

We understood his "point" perfectly. Muslim kids have never shot up or bombed schools in the US. Despite that, he believes we should be especially suspicious of Muslim kids.

The kid likely doesn't even understand his own religion, so to say it was right to be suspicious of his holding Islamic beliefs is offensive

You're doing what you accused him of doing - being unreasonable. That isn't what he said - you are way over reading.

But hey, when the skinheads come to school with instrument cases - and none of them are in band - you must agree that the school should not question them since that would be 'gasp' profiling, right?

Or maybe we should use common sense on both sides. A kid of Middle Eastern descent with an unknown device gets a little scrutiny about the device (not the idiocy that ensued in this case); white kids with neo-nazi tattoos get a little extra scrutiny about their sudden interest in music. People doing the scrutinizing are equally expected to show good judgment in regards to what they find.

And if you are stupid enough to invite scrutiny (which wasn't the case for the kid in question) you quit whining that it's unfair - what's unfair is a world in which we have to actually worry about kids killing each other in school in any manner whatsoever.

[Cow Poke]

Stop trying to find a contradiction that you can pick at.

Stop trying to tell me what to do.

The kid tried to explain himself as good as he could;

Yeah, you know this because you were there.

I'm sure he never imagined this happening. Put yourself in his shoes. He's just a fourteen year old boy still scared of the world, a small geeky kid, and he's being questioned like he's meant harm to someone. Then he's handcuffed, not allowed to call his Dad, and taken to the city jailhouse.

And that all stinks, to be sure.

I know I would of been peeing in my pants if that had happened to me as a kid.

Why does this not surprise me in the least?

[Cow Poke]

Take a look at a picture of the kid and stop pretending you can't see the basis for the paranoia.

I'm not pretending anything, except that it's possible to have a reasonable conversation with you. I'll go ahead and give up on that.

[Sea of red]

Yeah, you know this because you were there.

I've been watching the news.

And that all stinks, to be sure.

Not that you care - though if it was a Christian kid you no doubt would.

Why does this not surprise me in the least?

What's your problem?

[Cow Poke]

Actually ... names have a lot more to do with country of origin than religion. I've got a friend with an Irish last name but he ain't Roman Catholic ... or Protestant, for that matter.

OK, Sam, tomorrow, go up to anybody you run into and say "Ahmed Mohamed - what country does that make you think of?" Then try "Ahmed Mohamed - what religion does that make you think of?"

And I think you're being incredibly disingenuous --- are you TOTALLY unaware that even people who CONVERT to Islam change their names to an Islamic name? It's not like being Protestant or Catholic.

[Sam]

You're doing what you accused him of doing - being unreasonable. That isn't what he said - you are way over reading.

But hey, when the skinheads come to school with instrument cases - and none of them are in band - you must agree that the school should not question them since that would be 'gasp' profiling, right?

Or maybe we should use common sense on both sides. A kid of Middle Eastern descent with an unknown device gets a little scrutiny about the device (not the idiocy that ensued in this case); white kids with neo-nazi tattoos get a little extra scrutiny about their sudden interest in music. People doing the scrutinizing are equally expected to show good judgment in regards to what they find.

And if you are stupid enough to invite scrutiny (which wasn't the case for the kid in question) you quit whining that it's unfair - what's unfair is a world in which we have to actually worry about kids killing each other in school in any manner whatsoever.

I'm confused about the comparison between a kid of Middle-eastern descent, who was obviously enrolled in an engineering class at that school, and neo-Nazi-tattooed kids with no interest in school music activities suddenly showing up with closed instrument cases. Those seem like two really different scenarios.

[Sea of red]

I'm not pretending anything, except that it's possible to have a reasonable conversation with you. I'll go ahead and give up on that.

I've been pretending that you have an education and common sense, so I guess we're even in that respect.

[Cow Poke]

Not that you care - though if it was a Christian kid you no doubt would.

I actually DO care, you idiot. It was an overreaction, and I never tried to defend it in any way, shape or form. I simply questioned Sam's use of "race", where this most likely had a whole lot more to do with RELIGION - Islam in particular.

[Cow Poke]

I've been pretending that you have an education and common sense, so I guess we're even in that respect.

No, you haven't. You've assumed all along that I'm an ignorant Christian. You're not a very good liar.

[Jaecp]

My friend Mike, back when his nickname was Muslim Mike, used to have part of a standup routine he did where he described the life experience between most of the people at his mosque and himself.

When he got to an airport he just took off his hat and everyone left him alone

[Sam]

OK, Sam, tomorrow, go up to anybody you run into and say "Ahmed Mohamed - what country does that make you think of?" Then try "Ahmed Mohamed - what religion does that make you think of?"

And I think you're being incredibly disingenuous --- are you TOTALLY unaware that even people who CONVERT to Islam change their names to an Islamic name? It's not like being Protestant or Catholic.

As I wrote at the start, the religious and ethnic/racial aspects have been conflated.

And I'd think of predominately Middle-eastern or North African countries, personally. I think you're playing a losing game if you're suggesting that most people draw a clear line between ethnicity and religion.

[Sea of red]

You're doing what you accused him of doing - being unreasonable. That isn't what he said - you are way over reading.

But hey, when the skinheads come to school with instrument cases - and none of them are in band - you must agree that the school should not question them since that would be 'gasp' profiling, right?

Or maybe we should use common sense on both sides. A kid of Middle Eastern descent with an unknown device gets a little scrutiny about the device (not the idiocy that ensued in this case); white kids with neo-nazi tattoos get a little extra scrutiny about their sudden interest in music. People doing the scrutinizing are equally expected to show good judgment in regards to what they find.

And if you are stupid enough to invite scrutiny (which wasn't the case for the kid in question) you quit whining that it's unfair - what's unfair is a world in which we have to actually worry about kids killing each other in school in any manner whatsoever.

It's called a free country, Teal, get used to the idea.

The great thing about America is you can worship Martin Luther King, Jesus, or Adolf Hitler. Nothing is illegal or unconstitutional about that. As long as you don't harm or threaten to bring harm to anybody, you're free to live and enjoy whatever ideology or art forms you wish. Scrutiny has to based on behavior, not appearance and ignorant stereotypes of people - something that is the backbone of a free society.