Public service announcement about the De-energizing of Rural California.

[Teallaura]

From your link: While undergrounding is often prohibitively expensive, there is also a growing interest in having utilities insulate their power lines, making them less likely to trigger sparks and resulting fires. In the meantime, the main focus, of course, is more aggressive right-of-way work to keep trees and branches as far away from power lines as possible.

No freaking kidding.

Whoa, wait - the TRANSMISSION lines are the problem?!?! That's freaking insane! That's a whole 'nother level of messed up!


California is doomed.

[shunyadragon]

Lots of other states keep the power on in much worse drought conditions without burning down anything.

False, other states except some bordering California do not face the extreme drought, hurricane force Santana winds, and extreme temperatures Though increasing droughts in recent years occur in other Western regions, Australia, Africa and Asia as a result of Global Warming.

Anyway you look at it, something is very wrong in California.

These type of weather conditions and fires are not political, they have been annual events for thousands of years at least. combination that results in these devastating fires.

[mossrose]

These type of weather conditions and fires are not political, they have been annual events for thousands of years at least. combination that results in these devastating fires.

So, not AGW.

[rogue06]

False, other states except some bordering California do not face the extreme drought, hurricane force Santana winds, and extreme temperatures

Does Texas count? According to the U.S. Drought Monitor, Texas experienced a drought that lasted 271 weeks beginning on May 4, 2010 and ending on July 7, 2015. Often the drought reached a D4 classification (the worst level of drought) and at one point in October 2011 88% of the state was suffering under D4 conditions.

Last I heard Texas is some thousand plus miles away from California.

Though increasing droughts in recent years occur in other Western regions, Australia, Africa and Asia as a result of Global Warming.

Of course the same folks say that every storm or flood is also the result of AGW as well.

[Teallaura]

False, other states except some bordering California do not face the extreme drought, hurricane force Santana winds, and extreme temperatures Though increasing droughts in recent years occur in other Western regions, Australia, Africa and Asia as a result of Global Warming.



These type of weather conditions and fires are not political, they have been annual events for thousands of years at least. combination that results in these devastating fires.

Are you kidding? What was it, 20 - 30 years ago wildfire burned thousands upon thousands of acres all over the west. That was when the Forestry Service figured out that some small fires were better than letting the forest turn into a tinder box.

[Leonhard]

I generally agree with Teal on this one. Sounds like a case of mismanagement, and now everyone is playing the blame game, instead of just figuring out what the mistake is and what to do about it going forward.

Of course rural areas should have access to reliable electricity Shunya you moron.

[Leonhard]

Even though I'm in support of a complete transition to renewable energy, I also believe that everything is highly contextual. A solution that works for a huge metropolitan city, doesn't work for someone out desert of Arizona. And solution that work in Denmark where we have a highly efficient grid and a ton of wind, can't be translated elsewhere.

People need electricity. That California has to resort to turning off the grid as an emergency measure isn't the norm, and definitely shouldn't be expected. Its a problem that needs to be fixed.

If you're living a dozen miles away from high tension supplies of electricity, then I have absolutely no problem with you running a big fat diesel generator to run your home if that's the affordable solution.

Ignoring the living realities of people is a good way to sour them and lose any support on the things you want to do. If you want that person to move away from their homestead, or replace their cheap well-working diesel generator with another more expensive solution such as combined battery storage with solar roofing, then you need to sit down and talk to them and figure out what their reality is.

There's a lot of low hanging fruit to be picked before we get to that. I'd be more focused on people inflating their tires to the right pressure (which saves on fuel) before getting to that part.

[shunyadragon]

Does Texas count? According to the U.S. Drought Monitor, Texas experienced a drought that lasted 271 weeks beginning on May 4, 2010 and ending on July 7, 2015. Often the drought reached a D4 classification (the worst level of drought) and at one point in October 2011 88% of the state was suffering under D4 conditions.

Last I heard Texas is some thousand plus miles away from California.

I already mentioned that other regions have increased drought condition in the West.

Texas is indeed being influenced by the increased drought conditions in Western Texas, which have resulted in the greatly reduced availability of grazing land, but NO, Texas does not experience the extremes of seasonal hurricane force Santana winds that accompany the drought, and extremely high temperatures.



Of course the same folks say that every storm or flood is also the result of AGW as well.[/QUOTE]

[rogue06]

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[mikewhitney]

Even though I'm in support of a complete transition to renewable energy, I also believe that everything is highly contextual. A solution that works for a huge metropolitan city, doesn't work for someone out desert of Arizona. And solution that work in Denmark where we have a highly efficient grid and a ton of wind, can't be translated elsewhere.

People need electricity. That California has to resort to turning off the grid as an emergency measure isn't the norm, and definitely shouldn't be expected. Its a problem that needs to be fixed.

If you're living a dozen miles away from high tension supplies of electricity, then I have absolutely no problem with you running a big fat diesel generator to run your home if that's the affordable solution.

Ignoring the living realities of people is a good way to sour them and lose any support on the things you want to do. If you want that person to move away from their homestead, or replace their cheap well-working diesel generator with another more expensive solution such as combined battery storage with solar roofing, then you need to sit down and talk to them and figure out what their reality is.

There's a lot of low hanging fruit to be picked before we get to that. I'd be more focused on people inflating their tires to the right pressure (which saves on fuel) before getting to that part.

what do we do with those people sneaking around letting air out of our tires?

[Cow Poke]

I generally agree with Teal on this one. Sounds like a case of mismanagement, and now everyone is playing the blame game, instead of just figuring out what the mistake is and what to do about it going forward.

Of course rural areas should have access to reliable electricity Shunya you moron.

But, really - it's aliens!

[shunyadragon]

But, really - it's aliens!

Climate Change (GLobal Warming) is not considered the cause of the annual devastating fires in California, nor is it politics. For thousands of years or more there have been annual fires caused by the dry season, Santana winds, extreme temperatures, and the brush and small tree vegetation of the semi-arid regions in what was the wilderness in California. Read the News lately?

Though the trend of increased drought and temperature all across the Western USA has been attributed to Global Warming, but I do not consider it conclusive yet.

[rogue06]

Climate Change (GLobal Warming) is not considered the cause of the annual devastating fires in California, nor is it politics. For thousands of years or more there have been annual fires caused by the dry season, Santana winds, extreme temperatures, and the brush and small tree vegetation of the semi-arid regions in what was the wilderness in California. Read the News lately?

Though the trend of increased drought and temperature all across the Western USA has been attributed to Global Warming, but I do not consider it conclusive yet.

I don't think that anyone is suggesting that politics caused the fire but rather that it exacerbated the situation.


Kind of like Puerto Rico and the hurricanes in 2017. Politics didn't cause the hurricanes but it caused the situation that when a strong one hit directly it would utterly wipe out the infrastructure.

[shunyadragon]

I don't think that anyone is suggesting that politics caused the fire but rather that it exacerbated the situation.

Undocumented assertion based on a highly biased agenda. By the evidence the intensity and extent of the fires over the years is based the intensity of the winds and heat. The winds and heat this year are greater than in previous years.

Kind of like Puerto Rico and the hurricanes in 2017. Politics didn't cause the hurricanes but it caused the situation that when a strong one hit directly it would utterly wipe out the infrastructure.

The response by the US government very well may have political overtones, but hurricanes are one off events, and the cause of the devastation of Puerto Rico is dominated by the severity of the hurricane, which was huge. As far as the weakness in the electric utilities go, well maybe, but considering the intensity of the hurricane all the utilities would have been wiped out anyway.

The only similarity here is the hurricane in Puerto Rico, and the weather conditions and fires in California were far more greater and devastating than any in recent years.

The power cutoffs were justified based on the evidence that some fires were caused by debris being blown into live power lines. The over development of the 'wilderness' regions simply requires more power lines and increased danger.

The bottomline is this overdevelopment of these 'wilderness' regions should not happen. People should know that living in these regions puts their property and personal safety at risk much greater than other regions. It is like developing the lowlands of the Mississippi Delta, unfortunately this has happened in the past.

[shunyadragon]

I guess irony is lost on you.

Irony? It sounds like you are in anvil chucking contest, and out of touch with reality.