Mike Pence on how presidents should behave

[Charles]

EGGzackly.

Your boss may actually have some good work-related polices - and in those, you support him. Outside of work, he may be a womanizer or a gambler - doesn't mean you support either of those things.



Wanna bet he'll just double down on this?

The role model Pence wrote about was someone who was faithful to his wife and could serve as a role model of all we have been and can be. Now you are trying to change that into something that only relates to what is work related. That was not Pence's point.

[Sparko]

I never said I was upset and I generally feel you misunderstood the purpose of what I wrote at least to some extent. I actually said I supported his right to do this. What I pointed to was rather that by having such a policy you allow for something very unlikely to happen to have rather big consequences in cases where nothing would have happened. It is all very basically about the question whether I can meet other women without the idea of having sex with them or the idea that the will accuse me falsely should set certain conditions around that meeting. I have had quite many talks with women that would have been different if I followed Pence's policy. So, all I did was to say there is a price to pay and that he is free to do so if he thinks it is worth it.



My view is not misguided. That is a part of the religious base for it. However some may veil for other reasons. I support their right to do so in all cases. Once again I only point to the signals it can send if used for specific purposes.



And the precondition for the need to "make certain" is that you find it possible that someone would accuse you falsely or that you find it possible that something "unbecoming" happens. The first part is based on a lack of trust. The fact that this trust is not present set other conditions for whatever talk you may have. So there is a price to pay. The worry that something "unbecoming" happens also sets the scene for the relation between man and women in which the very idea that you could have sex with them needs to put certian conditions around everything else you can do with them. I think that price is way too high. If he is willing to pay it fine by me but I have found great values and insights and had many trustful conversations that I would have missed if a had done like Pence.

Think of it like having body guards present. Would you expect to be able to speak to Pence without him having body guards present? No. Does that mean he specifically doesn't trust you? No, it means that he is simply taking general precautions and it doesn't reflect on you personally. He isn't calling you dishonest or a threat.

And having other people present when he is with a woman who is not his wife is also reassuring to the other woman. She is assured that he will not attempt anything with other people present, so it is assurance both ways: That the woman cannot accuse him of anything and that he cannot attempt anything. win/win.

[Sparko]

So he is "tolerating" him by nodding everytime he says even the worst things on tv. And he is not only "tolerating" him, he is also working for him as a part of the administration. No one forced him to do that. He could have simply said no. Judging by what he read, he does not think Trump is fit, so why work for him? If he stod by his principles that is what he would have done. That is not being "a disloyal son-of-a-biscuit". It is being true to your principles. He was not and became a part of one of the worst administrations in American history. He is certainly not a person I would ask for moral guidance. Just ask all those who suffer the consequence of the policy of this administration.

Once again "his standards" were not a standard for himself. Not even a standard for himself if he became the president. It was a standard for the American president. The American president is currently Donald Trump who by no means live up to the standard and whom Pence works for every day. So he already broke with the principles before he might get the chance to become the president himself.

Has Trump had any affairs or done any womanizing since being in office?

[Cow Poke]

The role model Pence wrote about was someone who was faithful to his wife and could serve as a role model of all we have been and can be.

And there's no reason to believe he's not living up to that.

[Cow Poke]

Now you are trying to change that into something that only relates to what is work related. That was not Pence's point.

A) First of all, you are not the subject matter expert on Pence's intentions.
2) Nobody said it "only relates to what is work related".

[Charles]

Has Trump had any affairs or done any womanizing since being in office?

It would not surorise me if he had, but I do not know.

I don't see how he would be a role model if he had not. Having married three times and had sex with porn stars while married is not a role model.

[Cow Poke]

It would not surorise me if he had, but I do not know.

I don't see how he would be a role model if he had not. Having married three times and had sex with porn stars while married is not a role model.

We believe in redemption. Second chances. I work with people all the time who had horrible pasts, but have miraculously changed.

There are those, however, so filled with hate and judgment that they would never consider that people can change. You kinda sound like that, Charles.

[Charles]

And there's no reason to believe he's not living up to that.

We know that since he is a part of the Trump administration he is not living up to that.

[Cow Poke]

We know that since he is a part of the Trump administration he is not living up to that.

No, YOU "know" that because you practice guilt by association, and view Pence through your hatred for Trump. You must be a riot at parties.

[Charles]

We believe in redemption. Second chances. I work with people all the time who had horrible pasts, but have miraculously changed.

There are those, however, so filled with hate and judgment that they would never consider that people can change. You kinda sound like that, Charles.

What gives you the impression he has changed? And thanks for the personal attack that seems to contradict the impression that you somehow represent the loving side in this game.

[Charles]

No, YOU "know" that because you practice guilt by association, and view Pence through your hatred for Trump. You must be a riot at parties.

I practice the idea that if you are a part of an administration you should be held accountable no matter your high horse tendencies in texts written in the past.

[Cow Poke]

I practice the idea that if you are a part of an administration you should be held accountable no matter your high horse tendencies in texts written in the past.

And he should be held accountable for his own actions. If he strays from what he set as the standard, he's a hypocrite.

And I've changed my view on you being a kid. It's sounding more like you're a miserable old man full of judgment and hate.

[Mountain Man]

It seems to me that the most self righteous are those who always find a way to explain why priciples do not matter if they get in their way.

If it is in Pence's best interest you no longer need a president who can act as a role model though he said the opposite at a time when it was in his intetest to say so. Enjoy.

So if you work for or with anyone who does not share and uphold your personal core values then you're a hypocrite? I wonder if even Chuck the Self-Righteous is able to live up to such a lofty ideal. Even Jesus was known to associate with sinners. According to the Gospel of Chuck, that would make Jesus a hypocrite.

[Sparko]

It would not surorise me if he had, but I do not know.

I don't see how he would be a role model if he had not. Having married three times and had sex with porn stars while married is not a role model.

So exactly what should Pence be condeming him on if he has not done anything lately that goes against Pences' conditions for a President? Are you saying people can't change? Christianity is based on people who used to be sinners being saved and changed. Trump recently became a Christian, so why wouldn't Pence give him the benefit of the doubt?

[Cow Poke]

So if you work for or with anyone who does not share and uphold your personal core values then you're a hypocrite?

ONLY if you're a conservative. Libs get a free pass.

I wonder if even Chuck the Self-Righteous is able to live up to such a lofty ideal. Even Jesus was known to associate with sinners. According to the Gospel of Chuck, that would make Jesus a hypocrite.

Jesus was much kinder to down-and-outters, and much more harsh on the religions.


One my favorite hymns is "Christ Receiveth Sinful Men"