Dragphobia on the rise...

[rogue06]

Kinda like a ?

[tabibito]

Wrote something about that regarding investigations by the RCC into their pedophile priest problem that discovered the same thing but can't find it now.

There is a reasonable write up on it here.

[Mountain Man]

In spite of a goodly number of posters explaining that point to her in the "go, sell all that you have and give to the poor..." thread multiple times, she is either unwilling or incapable of understanding that.

To be fair, I was responding to Starlight, but our resident fraulein has made similarly ignorant remarks.

[Ronson]

There is a reasonable write up on it here.

I read an AP report on abuse cases in France. It claimed 80% of RCC abuse victims were boys, but outside the church, 75% of victims were girls. I'm not sure what conclusions can be drawn from those numbers - except that RCC priests prefer boys.

https://apnews.com/article/europe-fr...c770bf5af7ba38

ETA: Actually, one conclusion is that RCC pedophile opportunities differ than in the general population.

[Hypatia_Alexandria]

The point you seem intent on missing is the fact that homosexuals, whether self-identified, or identified by the nature of their sexual attractions, are considerably more likely than heterosexuals to sexually molest children.

I think you might find that within the professional community that has not been entirely proven.

[RumTumTugger]

In spite of a goodly number of posters explaining that point to her in the "go, sell all that you have and give to the poor..." thread multiple times, she is either unwilling or incapable of understanding that.

That was Starlight's fanciful interpretation Mountain Man was responding to.

[Starlight]

The point you seem intent on missing is the fact that homosexuals, whether self-identified, or identified by the nature of their sexual attractions, are considerably more likely than heterosexuals to sexually molest children.

When I looked through the academic papers on this subject a couple of years ago, the opposite had been found to be the case. (I saw you selectively cited a single study from 30 years ago above that had the opposite result) The speculation offered in the literature for an explanation for this was that (since sexual offending is mainly male, and that therefore what we are talking about here is not 'homosexuals' vs 'heterosexuals' but straight vs gay males) since the development of significant masculine features happens during puberty, that therefore pre-pubescent children are perceived as more feminine (regardless of sex) and therefore can often be attractive to straight men but lack the masculine features that would attract gay men. For this reason the researchers were seeing the majority of their cases being straight men, who were in relationships with adult women and who viewed themselves as straight, sexually abusing both girls and boys and not regarding the boys they abused as masculine.

[Mountain Man]

When I looked through the academic papers on this subject a couple of years ago, the opposite had been found to be the case. (I saw you selectively cited a single study from 30 years ago above that had the opposite result) The speculation offered in the literature for an explanation for this was that (since sexual offending is mainly male, and that therefore what we are talking about here is not 'homosexuals' vs 'heterosexuals' but straight vs gay males) since the development of significant masculine features happens during puberty, that therefore pre-pubescent children are perceived as more feminine (regardless of sex) and therefore can often be attractive to straight men but lack the masculine features that would attract gay men. For this reason the researchers were seeing the majority of their cases being straight men, who were in relationships with adult women and who viewed themselves as straight, sexually abusing both girls and boys and not regarding the boys they abused as masculine.

I suppose that's one way to rationalize it.

[rogue06]

Given the overwhelming majority of those who sexually abused children are men and that 95% of them are straight or "cis," it really should be no surprise that the victims are typically female. Given that, the numbers of young males molested ought to compose only about 5% of the victims of sexual abuse if gay males assaulted children at the same rate that straight males do. But the percent of male children sexually abused by men is much higher than 5% indicating that on average gay males are more likely to sexually assault a child than a straight male does.

[Starlight]

Given the overwhelming majority of those who sexually abused children are men and that 95% of them are straight or "cis," it really should be no surprise that the victims are typically female. Given that, the numbers of young males molested ought to compose only about 5% of the victims of sexual abuse if gay males assaulted children at the same rate that straight males do. But the percent of male children sexually abused by men is much higher than 5% indicating that on average gay males are more likely to sexually assault a child than a straight male does.

Two mistakes in that reasoning... you're conflating self-identification (gay/straight) with sexual behavior (who they have sex with). And you are assuming that if a man ever has sex with someone of the opposite sex, that they are 'gay', but you are not assuming that a man who ever has sex with someone of the same sex is 'straight'.

As I mentioned, the researchers found the commonest category of pedophile to be men who identified as straight, who had solely opposite-sex relationships with adults, and who molested both girls and boys. It's not very convincing to try to label such people 'gay'.

You could probably make your logic actually work though if you put 'Christian leaders' into the argument, and correctly conclude that Christian leaders were more likely to sexually assault children than the average person.

[Cow Poke]

Two mistakes in that reasoning... you're conflating self-identification (gay/straight) with sexual behavior (who they have sex with). And you are assuming that if a man ever has sex with someone of the opposite sex, that they are 'gay', but you are not assuming that a man who ever has sex with someone of the same sex is 'straight'.

As I mentioned, the researchers found the commonest category of pedophile to be men who identified as straight, who had solely opposite-sex relationships with adults, and who molested both girls and boys. It's not very convincing to try to label such people 'gay'.

You could probably make your logic actually work though if you put 'Christian leaders' into the argument, and correctly conclude that Christian leaders were more likely to sexually assault children than the average person.

That last part actually might make sense, as child molesters tend to gravitate to where children are vulnerable - peewee league coaches, t-ball, soccer, youth sports... "Christian Leaders" need to be especially vigilant for any men seeking to work with children.

[Hypatia_Alexandria]

When I looked through the academic papers on this subject a couple of years ago, the opposite had been found to be the case. (I saw you selectively cited a single study from 30 years ago above that had the opposite result) The speculation offered in the literature for an explanation for this was that (since sexual offending is mainly male, and that therefore what we are talking about here is not 'homosexuals' vs 'heterosexuals' but straight vs gay males) since the development of significant masculine features happens during puberty, that therefore pre-pubescent children are perceived as more feminine (regardless of sex) and therefore can often be attractive to straight men but lack the masculine features that would attract gay men. For this reason the researchers were seeing the majority of their cases being straight men, who were in relationships with adult women and who viewed themselves as straight, sexually abusing both girls and boys and not regarding the boys they abused as masculine.

The sentiments being expressed are not unknown among the Right [and Christian Right]. Gay men = paedophiles.

Note a marked reluctance to acknowledge that heterosexual men also abuse pre-pubescent minors!

The attitude seeming to be that such men are not really heterosexual because real heterosexual men [in the minds of some] are incapable of abusing pre-pubescent minors - presumably because it challenges their notions of their own male sexuality!

[Mountain Man]

The sentiments being expressed are not unknown among the Right [and Christian Right]. Gay men = paedophiles.

Note a marked reluctance to acknowledge that heterosexual men also abuse pre-pubescent minors!

The attitude seeming to be that such men are not really heterosexual because real heterosexual men [in the minds of some] are incapable of abusing pre-pubescent minors - presumably because it challenges their notions of their own male sexuality!

And who here has ever claimed that heterosexual men are incapable of pedophilia? The point is that by all accounts, homosexuals are significantly more likely than heterosexuals to be pedophiles.

[rogue06]

Two mistakes in that reasoning... you're conflating self-identification (gay/straight) with sexual behavior (who they have sex with). And you are assuming that if a man ever has sex with someone of the opposite sex, that they are 'gay', but you are not assuming that a man who ever has sex with someone of the same sex is 'straight'.

As I mentioned, the researchers found the commonest category of pedophile to be men who identified as straight, who had solely opposite-sex relationships with adults, and who molested both girls and boys. It's not very convincing to try to label such people 'gay'.

You could probably make your logic actually work though if you put 'Christian leaders' into the argument, and correctly conclude that Christian leaders were more likely to sexually assault children than the average person.

Interesting how in this case you appear to reject at least on some level the concept of someone self-identifying as something.

From what I read, those who abuse both sexes are actually rare and tend to abuse very young children. Moreover, pedophiles who molest boys have a higher recidivism rate than those who target girls.

[rogue06]

That last part actually might make sense, as child molesters tend to gravitate to where children are vulnerable - peewee league coaches, t-ball, soccer, youth sports... "Christian Leaders" need to be especially vigilant for any men seeking to work with children.

Yup. Predatorial pedophiles have even been known to take years working themselves up to a position of trust with the intent of using that position to molest children. And all fields where you come into a lot of contact with children are vulnerable.

Probably the best thing to do is start following the Billy Graham rule with kids as well, and to have at least two adults present at all times when dealing with a child individually.