The Blue Wall of Silence Is Starting to Crack

[Cow Poke]

Why are police associations and the services they provide to officers irrelevant to the need to curb unions that defend malfeasance among their members?

A) The "police associations" have absolutely NOTHING to do with "curbing unions".
2) Why are you so obsessed with police associations when the OP YOU posted deals with POLICE UNIONS as the biggest problem?

Once again, from the OP.....

We need every cop to wear a body camera. We need to curb the power of police unions, the biggest protectors of the blue wall. And we need officers of all stripes to back the words of those 14 in Minneapolis. They said, “This is not who we are.” Now prove it.

Police Associations have nothing whatsoever to do with that.

[Hypatia_Alexandria]

Feel free to start a thread on that -- it is irrelevant to the OP.

It does NOT, however, provide COLLECTIVE BARGAINING, which is the key to promoting and protecting bad policing.

Why are police associations and the services they provide to officers irrelevant to the need to curb unions that defend malfeasance among their members?

[Hypatia_Alexandria]

From post #184 which you inadvertently attributed to me

No - get RID of the "Police Unions" that have been enabling, protecting and defending bad cops. PERIOD. No "transfer of power".[...] The Police Chief doesn't need power "transferred" to him/her --- he/she should be allowed to exercise the power they're supposed to have by virtue of their office.

However, at post #119 part of your reply included this:

By returning power to COMMAND [...] and taking it away from the LABOR UNIONS.

And at post # 124 your reply included this:

Because it takes the power from the union and places it back into the hands of "command", who is accountable to the mayor, who is accountable to the people.

Both those comments refer directly to power being taken from one side and being returned to the other. In other words a transfer [i.e. To pass from one to another]

[Cow Poke]

So what service does it provide for officers?

Feel free to start a thread on that -- it is irrelevant to the OP.

It does NOT, however, provide COLLECTIVE BARGAINING, which is the key to promoting and protecting bad policing.

[Hypatia_Alexandria]

Absolutely irrelevant. It does NOT include the "collective bargaining" component of the LABOR UNIONS, so it does not protect bad cops.

There, you have your answer.

So what service does it provide for officers?

[Sparko]

Naw, she's looking for a fight where there doesn't need to be one --- it's about all she ever does here.

She sounds lonely.

[Sparko]

It isn't like this hasn't been pointed out to her several times. She's just looking for something to argue over.

She also has claimed that she wasn't demanding a "perfect" solution, and yet that is exactly what she has been demanding from CP, and even spelled it out in her last post to me:

Eliminating labour unions and placing the power with the Police Chief and/or representatives from the municipal authority and/or local politicians does not automatically guarantee an end to corruption.

[rogue06]

Cow Poke never said eliminating police unions would magically end corruption. He said that they were a contributing factor in corrupt cops getting away with it. Eliminating their protection of corrupt cops will aid in eliminating corrupt cops getting away with it. He never said it was THE solution.

It isn't like this hasn't been pointed out to her several times. She's just looking for something to argue over.

[Cow Poke]

You seem to be looking for simple solutions to complex problems.

Naw, she's looking for a fight where there doesn't need to be one --- it's about all she ever does here.

[Cow Poke]

Why is my name linked to this post? I didn't write it.

Because I accidentally edited your post, as I explained in the big red notice --- are you too stupid to see that?

Or are you planting evidence?

THIS notice......

Moderated By: CP

Did you miss the big "NOTICE" I posted where I admitted to my own stupidity in ACCIDENTALLY editing your post instead of RESPONDING to it?

***If you wish to take issue with this notice DO NOT do so in this thread.***
Contact the forum moderator or an administrator in Private Message or email instead. If you feel you must publicly complain or whine, please take it to the Padded Room unless told otherwise.

Then kindly delete it and re post under your own avatar.

Nope - I clearly posted the notice admitting my error.

Or is that task not possible for you?

It's certainly possible, but I'm not gonna do it.

[Sparko]

I am not defending unions that protect "bent coppers". I am pointing out that both sides are open corruption. And if you had read actually bothered to read all my replies to Cow Poke you would know that I fully accept there is always a risk of corruption.

However, checks and balances need to be put in place so ensure that honest officers can report legitimate concerns without fear of intimidation from their peers, higher ranks and/or local representatives/politicians/judiciary.

Eliminating labour unions and placing the power with the Police Chief and/or representatives from the municipal authority and/or local politicians does not automatically guarantee an end to corruption.

Surely that is self evident, isn't it?

Cow Poke never said eliminating police unions would magically end corruption. He said that they were a contributing factor in corrupt cops getting away with it. Eliminating their protection of corrupt cops will aid in eliminating corrupt cops getting away with it. He never said it was THE solution.

So, what is your solution? Remember, it has to be a solution that is a complete guaranteed end to police corruption, since that is the standard you seem to be holding Cow Poke to.

[CivilDiscourse]

I will repeat the question I put to you earlier.

If there is a wall of silence and cover ups how are the people to know their council and mayor are corrupt?

Given the paucity of public knowledge about Watergate in 1972 were those forty seven states culpable for re-electing a crook as a President?

You seem to be looking for simple solutions to complex problems.

[Hypatia_Alexandria]

You're about to prove your above statement wrong....



No - get RID of the "Police Unions" that have been enabling, protecting and defending bad cops. PERIOD. No "transfer of power".



The Police Chief doesn't need power "transferred" to him/her --- he/she should be allowed to exercise the power they're supposed to have by virtue of their office.



Actually, yes, I have ---- Allow "Command" to do their job.
If they're not doing their job - that's a problem for the Mayor (or city manager) and city council.
IF they're not doing their job - that's a problem for the citizenry who elected them.

I can't help it if you're too freakin' stupid to get that.

Moderated By: CP

And, talk about stupid!!! I accidentally EDITED your post instead of respond to it!

But there's enough of it there to see what you wrote and what I responded to!

***If you wish to take issue with this notice DO NOT do so in this thread.***
Contact the forum moderator or an administrator in Private Message or email instead. If you feel you must publicly complain or whine, please take it to the Padded Room unless told otherwise.

Why is my name linked to this post? I didn't write it.

Or are you planting evidence?

Moderated By: CP

Did you miss the big "NOTICE" I posted where I admitted to my own stupidity in ACCIDENTALLY editing your post instead of RESPONDING to it?

***If you wish to take issue with this notice DO NOT do so in this thread.***
Contact the forum moderator or an administrator in Private Message or email instead. If you feel you must publicly complain or whine, please take it to the Padded Room unless told otherwise.

[/QUOTE]

Then kindly delete it and re post under your own avatar. Or is that task not possible for you?

[Cow Poke]

We know this now answer the question with reference to your own police department's police association.

Who runs it?
Who works in it?
Who pays for it?
What services does it provide for officers?

Or does my previous post still stand?

Absolutely irrelevant. It does NOT include the "collective bargaining" component of the LABOR UNIONS, so it does not protect bad cops.

There, you have your answer.

[rogue06]

I am not demanding a "perfect solution" so kindly stop attributing things to me I have not written.

Yes you most certainly are as evidenced by how you keep diligently searching for an example where the offered solution might not be useful so that you can completely dismiss it.

This is one of those instances where actions speak louder than words.