Hillary's Troubles Solidify

[Carrikature]

Back to the topic du thread. It appears that Hillary's server was set up and maintained by 1) a civilian aide of Bill's who had no relevant experience and had no security clearance and 2) a State Department political employee who was doing it on the side, including during normal working hours when he was ostensibly doing his official job, breaking a host of regulations.

People here have the weirdest sources. Jewish World Review? How do you even find stuff like that?

And for supposedly referencing the report, they add in a lot of extras with zero information about sources. I wouldn't call that terribly trustworthy.

[One Bad Pig]

People here have the weirdest sources. Jewish World Review? How do you even find stuff like that?

And for supposedly referencing the report, they add in a lot of extras with zero information about sources. I wouldn't call that terribly trustworthy.

JWR is mostly an aggregator; I've been going there for years to read commentary from both sides of the spectrum. The columnist, Dick Morris, was an advisor to President Clinton, so he knows them fairly well.

[Carrikature]

JWR is mostly an aggregator; I've been going there for years to read commentary from both sides of the spectrum. The columnist, Dick Morris, was an advisor to President Clinton, so he knows them fairly well.

Interesting.

[seanD]

It says that unlike Trump, who benefited from there being several guys to split the 'establishment' vote (at least in the early primaries) as well as coverage, Hillary was lucky enough to have only one real opponent who wasn't establishment.

If it had just been Trump, Cruz, and Kasich at the start, I don't think Trump would have gotten the nomination.

That makes absolutely no sense to me considering how imbalanced Trump's victories were over the other candidates. I see it as the complete opposite. Had Trump run against just Cruz, or even better, just Rubio or Bush, the more establishment candidates, it would have been a much closer race. The status quo establishment picks were spread across numerous choices in the Republican camp. The anti-establishment pick was Trump, and only Trump. Likewise, had Hillary more status quo competition, the picksshe's getting would have been spread across a broader range of choices.

[Starlight]

One of my favorite lines from Clinton's emails is an aide saying: "I talked to Cheryl about this. She says the problem is H[illary] R[odham] C[linton] does not know how to use a computer to do e-mail, only B[lack]B[erry]".
The woman was/is technologically incompetent (like her husband, who was famous for never having sent a single email in his life).

Anyway, the known facts look pretty bad for Clinton on the email saga. I wouldn't be surprised if the FBI files 20+ charges at her for breaking 5+ different laws. The OIG report focused on the single question of whether she violated the department's implementation of the Federal Records Act, and the report said she did violate it. But it also implied quite a number of other possible violations of other laws and regulations. I suspect a lot of what's making life hard for the FBI investigators is that there's so many things we know Clinton did that range from 'bad practice' through to 'rules violations' through to 'wrong' through to 'a terrible idea', and they've got to look at all those different things in turn and sort out which of them they believe they could prove in court amount to 'breaking federal law'.

[Cow Poke]

One of my favorite lines from Clinton's emails is an aide saying: "I talked to Cheryl about this. She says the problem is H[illary] R[odham] C[linton] does not know how to use a computer to do e-mail, only B[lack]B[erry]".
The woman was/is technologically incompetent (like her husband, who was famous for never having sent a single email in his life).

Anyway, the known facts look pretty bad for Clinton on the email saga. I wouldn't be surprised if the FBI files 20+ charges at her for breaking 5+ different laws. The OIG report focused on the single question of whether she violated the department's implementation of the Federal Records Act, and the report said she did violate it. But it also implied quite a number of other possible violations of other laws and regulations. I suspect a lot of what's making life hard for the FBI investigators is that there's so many things we know Clinton did that range from 'bad practice' through to 'rules violations' through to 'wrong' through to 'a terrible idea', and they've got to look at all those different things in turn and sort out which of them they believe they could prove in court amount to 'breaking federal law'.

So, if she's not a crooked or, actually, a criminal, she's one of the most ignorant and/or incompetent people on the planet. Yeah, she should be POTUS!

[Starlight]

So, if she's not a crooked or, actually, a criminal, she's one of the most ignorant and/or incompetent people on the planet. Yeah, she should be POTUS!

The problem is that the Republicans have cried wolf so often, doing so many investigations of the Clintons in the past that amounted to nothing, that the average uninformed democratic voter in the streets hears "Clinton scandal" and translates that in their mind to "she's a strong women standing up to those Republicans who keep making up stuff about her". Polling showed that most democratic voters weren't worried in the least about this FBI investigation.

The media's done a poor job of conveying the notion that:
1. This is serious
2. This is not a Republican fake-scandal. It's not another Benghazi.
3. As time has gone on and more and more information has come to light, this has looked worse and worse and worse for her.

What worries me is what happens when the FBI publicly recommends indictment of her, and Clinton responds that she's going to stay in the presidential race and that the whole thing is a right-wing-conspiracy. At that point, the decision rests in the hands of the democratic party hierarchy, who have shown themselves to nearly all be shills for Clinton. So it's incredibly important for the party for the FBI to release its findings before California votes, in order that the voters can play a role in easing her out of the race.

[seanD]

The problem is that the Republicans have cried wolf so often, doing so many investigations of the Clintons in the past that amounted to nothing, that the average uninformed democratic voter in the streets hears "Clinton scandal" and translates that in their mind to "she's a strong women standing up to those Republicans who keep making up stuff about her". Polling showed that most democratic voters weren't worried in the least about this FBI investigation.

The media's done a poor job of conveying the notion that:
1. This is serious
2. This is not a Republican fake-scandal. It's not another Benghazi.
3. As time has gone on and more and more information has come to light, this has looked worse and worse and worse for her.

What worries me is what happens when the FBI publicly recommends indictment of her, and Clinton responds that she's going to stay in the presidential race and that the whole thing is a right-wing-conspiracy. At that point, the decision rests in the hands of the democratic party hierarchy, who have shown themselves to nearly all be shills for Clinton. So it's incredibly important for the party for the FBI to release its findings before California votes, in order that the voters can play a role in easing her out of the race.

What do you think will happen if Biden steps in her place?

[Starlight]

Even the neutral and unflappable Associated Press (AP) is apparently sick of being lied to by Clinton on this issue:
AP FACT CHECK: Clinton misstates key facts in email episode.

One possible mitigating factor to some of those lies though: Clinton is technologically incompetent, so she probably doesn't understand the issues. e.g. When asked about the security of her server she said that the secret service were guarding the property it was on. She possibly didn't have any level of understanding of the technical difference between a private email server (which had been set up for her) and a private email account (which she knew Colin Powell had had) so she didn't bother to ask anyone permission, because she assumed that she was doing the same thing as him.

More troubling is the employees who report being told "never to speak of the Secretary's personal email system again" (albeit not by Clinton herself) and Clinton's claim that "I'm more than ready to talk to anybody anytime" and then her subsequent refusal to cooperate with investigators.

[Cow Poke]

The media's done a poor ...

They don't do investigative reporting anymore.

[Starlight]

What do you think will happen if Biden steps in her place?

Yeah apparently received wisdom in D.C. is that if Clinton is forced to drop out by the FBI, then they'll sub-in Biden in her place. I doubt they could do that successfully without destroying the party.

They could possibly provide themselves some cover if they could roll out multiple polls showing: (a) Biden being more popular than Sanders among democratic primary voters, or (b) Biden doing better in match-ups against Trump. But past polling data suggests that Sanders would easily be the stronger candidate on both those things.

[seanD]

What constitutes "destroying the party"? The way it looks to me, the democratic party is already in more disarray than even the GOP.

[Cow Poke]

What constitutes "destroying the party"? The way it looks to me, the democratic party is already in more disarray than even the GOP.

You can really tell this is true because the media portrays pretty much a "sameness" as to the disarray.

[Starlight]

What constitutes "destroying the party"?

Protest marches in the streets. A drop of ~50% in their membership, donations, and votes. More people writing in Sanders' name in November than end up voting for Biden. Democrats losing badly in the house and senate in November.

[Cow Poke]

Protest marches in the streets. A drop of ~50% in their membership, donations, and votes. More people writing in Sanders' name in November than end up voting for Biden. Democrats losing badly in the house and senate in November.

A 1968 style riot at their convention...