Affordable Care Act Falling Apart?

[seer]

ok bye for today, I really got to get going

Before you go, well, because we like you!

[jordanriver]

jordanriver had said, "during 1920s , (Russian history) considered Golden Age of Soviets, as long as Lenin was in charge. He allowed peasants to take over land, landowners were booted out. In factories owners/supervisors carted out of factories in wheelbarrows."

So, he allowed total chaos, and you say this like it's a good thing.

At least they weren't tarred and feathered like the Torries , or beaten up by gangs of American Patriots , and chased off to Canada and other parts of the British Empire, bearing the shame of failure to preserve the King's American colonies.

Yeah, Stalin was such a role model!

However, he ruled by terror, and millions of his own citizens died during his brutal reign. Born into poverty, Stalin became involved in revolutionary politics, as well as criminal activities, as a young man. After Bolshevik leader Vladimir Lenin (1870-1924) died, Stalin outmaneuvered his rivals for control of the party. Once in power, he collectivized farming and had potential enemies executed or sent to forced labor camps. Stalin aligned with the United States and Britain in World War II (1939-1945) but afterward engaged in an increasingly tense relationship with the West known as the Cold War (1946-1991). After his death, the Soviets initiated a de-Stalinization process.

You're really not doing so well as an apologist for your side.

?
whoa whoa,
I wasn't defending Stalin. Did you not notice my qualifier "tyrant",

that was not Marxist egalitarianism.

[jordanriver]

which is why communism and socialism only survives as long as they conquer more peoples. They are predators, and scavengers. They have to kill more countries and live off their corpses for a while, then expand again. Eventually they will collapse and implode like the USSR did. The only reason China is still going on is that it is so huge it takes longer to implode, and they are staving off the inevitable by embracing capitalism albeit with slave labor and cutting corners and stealing patents.

I think there's a few chapters missing from your American history book.

Americans occupy the globe, and the only time I saw any commie occupy America was in 20140215-230528.jpg

[jordanriver]

actually if they are getting paid for not doing their job, then it is not capitalism. is is socialism. Now if it were capitalism, then when the client was not satisfied with your work he would not pay you and you would not pay your workers, so they would either go find other jobs or start doing a good job and therefore earn their pay. If you can't fire them and they get paid to do nothing, then it is socialism. A handout for a pretend job.

that does happen

sort of.

When clients are finally fed up, they get rid of us.

Same as when clients are fed up with some other contractor, they hire us.

Then after a contract is up, we get our client back because they got fed up with our replacement, and the clients who hired us from some other contractor returns to that one

or some other one,

and eventually we get that client back , and eventually all the contractors go through all the clients,

Kind of like restaurant workers, they all make the rounds.

Its like musical chairs.

[jordanriver]

IOW, it doesn't work.

I know a lot of Americans who think the American Dream is a scam.

I have seen some of them, years ago , when they were smug in their success, a good job, good benefits, their attitude toward others less successful was, "well you should have worked hard like me"

Then their employer decided to remove their division from the payroll and hire a contractor. And they were welcome to stay but they would need to fill out an application to work for the contractor. Their new employer was going to keep some of the money that the company paid for that labor for himself.

And now when I fill in , or do a walk through, its "hey old buddy, haven't seen you here in a while, ....say, do you think you could get me on with you, do you guys have any openings?"


I supervise some people I used to help clean up after, and take out their trash.

[jordanriver]

Before you go, well, because we like you!

spaceebah balshoi.

but I prefer Katyusha or Kalinka better.

[Sparko]

that does happen

sort of.

When clients are finally fed up, they get rid of us.

Same as when clients are fed up with some other contractor, they hire us.

Then after a contract is up, we get our client back because they got fed up with our replacement, and the clients who hired us from some other contractor returns to that one

or some other one,

and eventually we get that client back , and eventually all the contractors go through all the clients,

Kind of like restaurant workers, they all make the rounds.

Its like musical chairs.

Or, here is a wild concept for you...

You could do a good job and make your clients happy instead of "fed-up" with you! Have a good work ethic instead of being a lazy dumbass.

[Cow Poke]

Or, here is a wild concept for you...

You could do a good job and make your clients happy instead of "fed-up" with you! Have a good work ethic instead of being a lazy dumbass.

But, Sparko, that takes actual WORK, not just words!

[Cow Poke]

I know a lot of Americans who think the American Dream is a scam.

And I know a lot of Americans who are living the dream, because they understand they have to work for it, not just sit around hoping it will happen.

I have seen some of them, years ago , when they were smug in their success, a good job, good benefits, their attitude toward others less successful was, "well you should have worked hard like me"

I think you're making this up.

Then their employer decided to remove their division from the payroll and hire a contractor. And they were welcome to stay but they would need to fill out an application to work for the contractor. Their new employer was going to keep some of the money that the company paid for that labor for himself.

And now when I fill in , or do a walk through, its "hey old buddy, haven't seen you here in a while, ....say, do you think you could get me on with you, do you guys have any openings?"


I supervise some people I used to help clean up after, and take out their trash.

Yeah, life happens, but you keep on going!

[Littlejoe]

Or, here is a wild concept for you...

You could do a good job and make your clients happy instead of "fed-up" with you! Have a good work ethic instead of being a lazy dumbass.

Yeah...sadly, it doesn't work like that it seems with contractors. As a contractor working in a job that used to be manned by in house people, I can tell you on this Jordan has a point. Big companies for years have been using outsourcing to artificially inflate the price of their Shares. They have a couple of down quarters (or years) and so they announce they are cutting "X" number of jobs. What they really do is outsource them to another company...often times (as Jordan mentioned) hiring back the very workers that were "downsized". Of course, the company doing the outsourcing wants to spend less money, and the company taking the contract wants to MAKE money. But, when you add a whole 'nuther layer of management to the mix and less money actually going out, you lose a lot of your top people. The wages go down as the new company can't pay you what you were making and make a profit. Then, there is the resultant drop in performance of the whole group as those top people are replaced with people with much less experience...and much less pay. Then they start trying to maximize the payoff of the contract by not giving raises, cutting benefits etc., so even more experienced people leave, only to be replaced by lesser employee's (because they don't pay market wages). Then the customer gets dissatisfied with the service and wants to pay less for the service at contract renewal time. So, they take less or lose the contract...then the spiral continues downward as no merit raises are given for any reason and the experienced, hard working employees...who care about providing quality service in their job, realize that where they are is where they will stay and they gradually quit caring. Then the service really sucks and then at contract renewal, regardless of the price, they fire the contractor. I understand your thinking, but it seems that this mentality is rampant in the contracting world....and it seems to be the way more and more companies are doing business these days.

[Cow Poke]

Yeah...sadly, it doesn't work like that it seems with contractors. As a contractor working in a job that used to be manned by in house people, I can tell you on this Jordan has a point. Big companies for years have been using outsourcing to artificially inflate the price of their Shares. They have a couple of down quarters (or years) and so they announce they are cutting "X" number of jobs. What they really do is outsource them to another company...often times (as Jordan mentioned) hiring back the very workers that were "downsized". Of course, the company doing the outsourcing wants to spend less money, and the company taking the contract wants to MAKE money. But, when you add a whole 'nuther layer of management to the mix and less money actually going out, you lose a lot of your top people. The wages go down as the new company can't pay you what you were making and make a profit. Then, there is the resultant drop in performance of the whole group as those top people are replaced with people with much less experience...and much less pay. Then they start trying to maximize the payoff of the contract by not giving raises, cutting benefits etc., so even more experienced people leave, only to be replaced by lesser employee's (because they don't pay market wages). Then the customer gets dissatisfied with the service and wants to pay less for the service at contract renewal time. So, they take less or lose the contract...then the spiral continues downward as no merit raises are given for any reason and the experienced, hard working employees...who care about providing quality service in their job, realize that where they are is where they will stay and they gradually quit caring. Then the service really sucks and then at contract renewal, regardless of the price, they fire the contractor. I understand your thinking, but it seems that this mentality is rampant in the contracting world....and it seems to be the way more and more companies are doing business these days.

But you didn't sit around whining about the system, LJ - you hustled and got back in the game.

[Sparko]

And I know a lot of Americans who are living the dream, because they understand they have to work for it, not just sit around hoping it will happen.



I think you're making this up.







Yeah, life happens, but you keep on going!

He meant "that I used to pretend to clean up after while actually sitting down and napping on the job"

[jordanriver]

Yeah...sadly, it doesn't work like that it seems with contractors. As a contractor working in a job that used to be manned by in house people, I can tell you on this Jordan has a point. Big companies for years have been using outsourcing to artificially inflate the price of their Shares. They have a couple of down quarters (or years) and so they announce they are cutting "X" number of jobs. What they really do is outsource them to another company...often times (as Jordan mentioned) hiring back the very workers that were "downsized". Of course, the company doing the outsourcing wants to spend less money, and the company taking the contract wants to MAKE money. But, when you add a whole 'nuther layer of management to the mix and less money actually going out, you lose a lot of your top people. The wages go down as the new company can't pay you what you were making and make a profit. Then, there is the resultant drop in performance of the whole group as those top people are replaced with people with much less experience...and much less pay. Then they start trying to maximize the payoff of the contract by not giving raises, cutting benefits etc., so even more experienced people leave, only to be replaced by lesser employee's (because they don't pay market wages). Then the customer gets dissatisfied with the service and wants to pay less for the service at contract renewal time. So, they take less or lose the contract...then the spiral continues downward as no merit raises are given for any reason and the experienced, hard working employees...who care about providing quality service in their job, realize that where they are is where they will stay and they gradually quit caring. Then the service really sucks and then at contract renewal, regardless of the price, they fire the contractor. I understand your thinking, but it seems that this mentality is rampant in the contracting world....and it seems to be the way more and more companies are doing business these days.

thank you

[Littlejoe]

But you didn't sit around whining about the system, LJ - you hustled and got back in the game.

I'm still in that job...

I'm one of the ones looking really hard for another job...but not finding it. I've been to the final 3 two different times only to not be the one chosen...actual after debrief conversations and info from friends working at these companies, I came in second both times.

[Sparko]

Yeah...sadly, it doesn't work like that it seems with contractors. As a contractor working in a job that used to be manned by in house people, I can tell you on this Jordan has a point. Big companies for years have been using outsourcing to artificially inflate the price of their Shares. They have a couple of down quarters (or years) and so they announce they are cutting "X" number of jobs. What they really do is outsource them to another company...often times (as Jordan mentioned) hiring back the very workers that were "downsized". Of course, the company doing the outsourcing wants to spend less money, and the company taking the contract wants to MAKE money. But, when you add a whole 'nuther layer of management to the mix and less money actually going out, you lose a lot of your top people. The wages go down as the new company can't pay you what you were making and make a profit. Then, there is the resultant drop in performance of the whole group as those top people are replaced with people with much less experience...and much less pay. Then they start trying to maximize the payoff of the contract by not giving raises, cutting benefits etc., so even more experienced people leave, only to be replaced by lesser employee's (because they don't pay market wages). Then the customer gets dissatisfied with the service and wants to pay less for the service at contract renewal time. So, they take less or lose the contract...then the spiral continues downward as no merit raises are given for any reason and the experienced, hard working employees...who care about providing quality service in their job, realize that where they are is where they will stay and they gradually quit caring. Then the service really sucks and then at contract renewal, regardless of the price, they fire the contractor. I understand your thinking, but it seems that this mentality is rampant in the contracting world....and it seems to be the way more and more companies are doing business these days.

Jordan talked about his workers not doing the work and laughing at him if he tried to get them to do the work. That is bullcrap on a stick. If that is how he runs his company, then he deserves to lose his contract and his business. If he wants to keep his business he should actually get workers that DO the work and keep the customer happy. Then he will grow his business instead of losing it. Jordan thinks that he doesn't have to do the work and can sit on his rear end and collect money for nothing.

So no matter HOW he got his contract, it is up to him to keep it by actually doing the work he is contracted to do. If he is stiffing his workers so that they don't want to do the work, then he needs to fix that, if he is paying them and they still won't do the work, he needs to fire them and hire someone who will do the work.