Originally posted by seer
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Cogito ergo sum
Here in the Philosophy forum we will talk about all the "why" questions. We'll have conversations about the way in which philosophy and theology and religion interact with each other. Metaphysics, ontology, origins, truth? They're all fair game so jump right in and have some fun! But remember...play nice!
Forum Rules: Here
Here in the Philosophy forum we will talk about all the "why" questions. We'll have conversations about the way in which philosophy and theology and religion interact with each other. Metaphysics, ontology, origins, truth? They're all fair game so jump right in and have some fun! But remember...play nice!
Forum Rules: Here
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Science of Morality
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Originally posted by Tassman View PostSo you agree that your alleged 'libertarian free will' is logical nonsense. It cannot exist because of the many physical and subconscious factors that comprise every decision we make.Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s
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Originally posted by Tassman View Postin whatever way you can. But it seems you cannot.
Don't try to drag me down to your delusional level, seer. They are empirically verified fact beliefs.
Sorry, I asked you first, you keep saying that this is a deterministic universe - do you agree that on the quantum level that it is not? Whether that is an opening for LFW is not in question right now.
Once again: These behaviours are enforced according to the natures of the various species.
What part of this don't you understand? Waiting?Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s
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Originally posted by seer View PostNo, I would say that children and the mentally handicapped are not morally responsible (there are different degrees of course). And "evidence?" Like your evidence for objective moral values Thinker? And you do agree that the ISIS killers are only doing what nature determined them to do - correct?Blog: Atheism and the City
If your whole worldview rests on a particular claim being true, you damn well better have evidence for it. You should have tons of evidence.
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Originally posted by The Thinker View PostUm yes, I've given you plenty of evidence for objective moral values over a period of two months, and I successfully showed that grounding morality in god is totally unintelligible and forces you into a trilemma. As far as ISIS, you want to believe they have free will right? Well, make a positive argument showing free will exists. I've challenged you to that for weeks and weeks to coherently explain it, and all I hear is crickets. You're a joke seer. Who can take you serious?Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s
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Originally posted by seer View PostNo Tass, I don't need to show anything - all I need to do is to make it clear that you can not prove that this universe is "natural" or that the "natural" is all that exists.Well no, that is your faith Tass, empirically verify that this is a "natural" universe or that the "natural" is all that exists.Sorry, I asked you first, you keep saying that this is a deterministic universe - do you agree that on the quantum level that it is not? Whether that is an opening for LFW is not in question right now.I will ask again; When one group of male chimps kills another group of male chimps and take their females and territory how are the morally responsible? Still waiting for a direct answer.
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Then present your evidence that this universe is "natural" i.e. was created by a natural source or cause. If you can't, then you have no real idea if this is a "natural" universe, it is a faith position on your end.
But I'm not claiming anything about LFW at this point. You keep making the claim that LFW is not possible in a deterministic universe, OK fine - so the first question is, is the universe really deterministic. Is the quantum world, which underpins all matter and energy, deterministic Tass? Why are you afraid to answer this.
Again Tass, you have avoided a direct answer to my question: When one group of male chimps kills another group of male chimps and take their females and territory how are the morally responsible? And I would also say that the killer chimps had a better survival strategy since they thrived after killing the weaker chimps and taking their females and territory - you agree that it was a good survival strategy - correct?Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s
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Originally posted by seer View PostThen present your evidence that this universe is "natural" i.e. was created by a natural source or cause. If you can't, then you have no real idea if this is a "natural" universe, it is a faith position on your end.But I'm not claiming anything about LFW at this point. You keep making the claim that LFW is not possible in a deterministic universe, OK fine - so the first question is, is the universe really deterministic. Is the quantum world, which underpins all matter and energy, deterministic Tass? Why are you afraid to answer this.Again Tass, you have avoided a direct answer to my question: When one group of male chimps kills another group of male chimps and take their females and territory how are the morally responsible? And I would also say that the killer chimps had a better survival strategy since they thrived after killing the weaker chimps and taking their females and territory - you agree that it was a good survival strategy - correct?
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No Tass, that is why I asked - what would a "natural" universe look like compared to a universe that did not have a natural source. You had no answer.
Again Tass no, one of your main arguments against the possibility of LFW was the fact that we live in a deterministic universe - just admit that we don't and we can move on.
And of course you again did not answer the main question: When one group of male chimps kills another group of male chimps and take their females and territory how are the morally responsible? And I'm not sure what is "sad" about what ISIS is doing - they are only doing what nature determined them to do. Is it "sad" when a large fish eats a smaller fish?Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s
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Here's something for AlecWelsh to read, if he's still interested in arguing for a scientific morality based upon maximising the well being of all sentient creatures. It's the recent "" post on the 'Evolution Is True' website by a certain Jerry Coyne.
Coyne disagrees with the ideas which Sam Harris proposed a few years ago in his "The Moral Landscape" book; and unless I am very mistaken Coyne also disagrees with the Harris-look-alike ideas AlecWelsh started this thread with.Last edited by David Hayward; 11-27-2015, 03:55 PM.
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Originally posted by David Hayward View PostHere's something for AlecWelsh to read, if he's still interested in arguing for a scientific morality based upon maximising the well being of all sentient creatures. It's the recent "" post on the 'Evolution Is True' website by a certain Jerry Coyne.
Coyne disagrees with the ideas which Sam Harris proposed a few years ago in his "The Moral Landscape" book; and unless I am very mistaken Coyne also disagrees with the Harris-look-alike ideas AlecWelsh started this thread with.Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s
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Originally posted by David Hayward View PostHere's something for AlecWelsh to read, if he's still interested in arguing for a scientific morality based upon maximising the well being of all sentient creatures. It's the recent "" post on the 'Evolution Is True' website by a certain Jerry Coyne.
Coyne disagrees with the ideas which Sam Harris proposed a few years ago in his "The Moral Landscape" book; and unless I am very mistaken Coyne also disagrees with the Harris-look-alike ideas AlecWelsh started this thread with.
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Originally posted by JimL View PostA natural universe would look exactly like the one that you exist in.Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s
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