Originally posted by lee_merrill
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If you think this is the area where you tell everyone you are sorry for eating their lunch out of the fridge, it probably isn't the place for you
This forum is open discussion between atheists and all theists to defend and debate their views on religion or non-religion. Please respect that this is a Christian-owned forum and refrain from gratuitous blasphemy. VERY wide leeway is given in range of expression and allowable behavior as compared to other areas of the forum, and moderation is not overly involved unless necessary. Please keep this in mind. Atheists who wish to interact with theists in a way that does not seek to undermine theistic faith may participate in the World Religions Department. Non-debate question and answers and mild and less confrontational discussions can take place in General Theistics.
Forum Rules: Here
This forum is open discussion between atheists and all theists to defend and debate their views on religion or non-religion. Please respect that this is a Christian-owned forum and refrain from gratuitous blasphemy. VERY wide leeway is given in range of expression and allowable behavior as compared to other areas of the forum, and moderation is not overly involved unless necessary. Please keep this in mind. Atheists who wish to interact with theists in a way that does not seek to undermine theistic faith may participate in the World Religions Department. Non-debate question and answers and mild and less confrontational discussions can take place in General Theistics.
Forum Rules: Here
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Fulfilled prophecy- I will build my church
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Originally posted by 37818 View PostWhile being dated from the 6th century BC, what is written much latter is based on past on oral traditions prior to any cited written teachings. The teachings of the Christian New Testament were written from within the time when eye witnesses where known to the writers.Last edited by Seeker; 06-10-2020, 02:46 AM.
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Originally posted by Seeker View PostBut why would anyone write about an event as great as the Ressurection only about 40 years later (Paul's earliest letters)...?
Blessings,
Lee"What I pray of you is, to keep your eye upon Him, for that is everything. Do you say, 'How am I to keep my eye on Him?' I reply, keep your eye off everything else, and you will soon see Him. All depends on the eye of faith being kept on Him. How simple it is!" (J.B. Stoney)
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Originally posted by lee_merrill View PostBut the gospels are earlier than Paul's letters...
Blessings,
Lee
''The Pauline epistles, also called Epistles of Paul or Letters of Paul, are the thirteen books of the New Testament attributed to Paul the Apostle, although the authorship of some is in dispute. Among these epistles are some of the earliest extant Christian documents. They provide an insight into the beliefs and controversies of early Christianity''.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pauline_epistles
Regards.Last edited by Seeker; 06-13-2020, 05:48 PM.
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Originally posted by Seeker View Postthey predate the earliest of the Gospels, Mark, by at least ten years
They continue:
Another point worthy of mention in the article is that the gospels make no mention of the destruction of the temple in A.D. 70.
Blessings,
Lee"What I pray of you is, to keep your eye upon Him, for that is everything. Do you say, 'How am I to keep my eye on Him?' I reply, keep your eye off everything else, and you will soon see Him. All depends on the eye of faith being kept on Him. How simple it is!" (J.B. Stoney)
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Originally posted by lee_merrill View PostOriginally posted by Whateverman View PostThe simple fact is that Buddhism has been around for thousands of years longer than Christianity has, and where you see success in growing the Christian church, you can find similar successes in Buddhism or Islam.
Originally posted by lee_merrill View PostSo we shall see how this turns out...
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Originally posted by Whateverman View PostSince Christianity became a rejection of Judaism, you don't get to count the age of one as the age of the other.
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Originally posted by Chrawnus View PostThe Rabbinic Judaism of today is the development of a single surviving strand of Judaism from the various kinds of "Judaisms" that existed in 1st century Judaea. That Christianity rejected that particular strand of Judaism does not mean that we "don't get to count the age of one as the age of the other".
For the purpose of determining the age of a religion, Christianity is not Judaism - and I respectfully submit to you that you know this as well.
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Originally posted by Whateverman View PostThere isn't a Jew alive who thinks Jesus really was God made flesh.The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.
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Originally posted by Whateverman View PostThere isn't a Jew alive who thinks Jesus really was God made flesh. To the extent that Christians DO think this, they've rejected most (if not all) Judaisms.
For the purpose of determining the age of a religion, Christianity is not Judaism - and I respectfully submit to you that you know this as well.
As Larry Hurtado has convincingly argued, devotion towards Jesus among early Jewish Christians shows that the view that Jesus was divine did not arise as a result of hellenistic syncretism among hellenistic Jews (or because of Paul) but amongst the very earliest Jewish followers of Jesus, who still strongly maintained a very rigid monotheistic outlook.Last edited by JonathanL; 06-23-2020, 06:42 PM.
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Originally posted by Chrawnus View PostThere were numerous forms of 2nd Temple Judaism in the 1st century of which some could have more or less easily accomodated the type of views that would later develop into orthodox Christianity.
Originally posted by Chrawnus View PostImplying that something like Rabbinic Judaism is the only legitimate strand/tradition of Judaism that survives from the 1st century is absurd and exposes an ignorance about the current state of knowledge about the diverse forms of 2nd Temple Judaisms that were prevalent during the 1st century in which Christianity originated.
Originally posted by Chrawnus View PostAs Larry Hurtado has convincingly argued, devotion towards Jesus among early Jewish Christians shows that the view that Jesus was divine did not arise as a result of hellenistic syncretism among hellenistic Jews (or because of Paul) but amongst the very earliest Jewish followers of Jesus, who still strongly maintained a very rigid monotheistic outlook.
You regularly refer to Hurtado - is he your only source on these matters?"It ain't necessarily so
The things that you're liable
To read in the Bible
It ain't necessarily so."
Sportin' Life
Porgy & Bess, DuBose Heyward, George & Ira Gershwin
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