Three irrefutable miracles.

[37818]

There are no gods. Natural law is the eternal, infinite, uncaused existence.

Existence and law are different things. Law is contingent on existing.

[JimL]

Existence and law are different things. Law is contingent on existing.

Laws are not existing things, they are merely descriptive of existence, therefore it is incorrect to define them as contingent. In the abstract sense of their existence, the laws are as eternal as that which they are descriptive of.

[shunyadragon]

Existence and law are different things. Law is contingent on existing.

Actually there is no objective verifiable evidence that Natural Law is contingent on anything, and it is possible that it is eternal without cause. Natural Law is not a thing nor things.

This is simply an assertion on your part based on your agenda.

[Tassman]

Existence and law are different things. Law is contingent on existing.

It is possible that Natural Law is eternal without cause; the fact that you prefer to assign eternal existence to a deity does not necessarily make it so.

[37818]

It is possible that Natural Law is eternal without cause; the fact that you prefer to assign eternal existence to a deity does not necessarily make it so.

Natural Law being uncaused would not make it not finite and temporal in nature. It would be an uncaused cause, so to speak, which would be both eternal and temporal.

Uncaused existence being the only entity qualified to be God.

That uncaused existence is not necessarily deity, that God is not necessarily God. Uncaused existence is the only self existent. Any other uncaused entity would be contingent on it.

[37818]

Actually there is no objective verifiable evidence that Natural Law is contingent on anything, and it is possible that it is eternal without cause. Natural Law is not a thing nor things.

This is simply an assertion on your part based on your agenda.

Natural Law is not strictly just existence. Only uncaused existence is just existence.

[Tassman]

Natural Law is not strictly just existence. Only uncaused existence is just existence.

So "uncaused existence" is what you say it is, yes? And, to you, it will always be God, come what may.

[shunyadragon]

Natural Law is not strictly just existence. Only uncaused existence is just existence.

Does not make sense

[37818]

Only . . . existence is . . . existence.

Does not make sense

Makes sense to me.

[37818]

So "uncaused existence" is what you say it is, yes? And, to you, it will always be God, come what may.

Uncaused existence has no god. So unless it uncaused Existence is God there would be none.

[shunyadragon]

Natural Law is not strictly just existence.

Never claimed it was. It is the eternal Natural Cause of all cause and effect outcomes of our eternal physical existence.

Only uncaused existence is just existence.

True, and our eternal physical existence is possibly eternal and infinite.

[37818]

Never claimed it was. It is the eternal Natural Cause of all cause and effect outcomes of our eternal physical existence.

That is a metaphysical claim. There no evidence that what is now physical is eternal.

True, and our eternal physical existence is possibly eternal and infinite.

It is a circular supposition, mere belief that it is possible.

[shunyadragon]

That is a metaphysical claim. There no evidence that what is now physical is eternal.

The possibility that the Quantum World is eternal and/or infinite is a scientific claim.

It is a circular supposition, mere belief that it is possible.

No it is not circular, because it is only a possibility, based on the known evidence of the Quantum Mechanics and the Quantum World..

[37818]

The possibility that the Quantum World is eternal and/or infinite is a scientific claim.

Then this scientific claim is a metaphysical claim.

No it is not circular, because it is only a possibility, based on the known evidence of the Quantum Mechanics and the Quantum World..

No. what is circular was your statement ". . . eternal physical existence is possibly eternal . . . ." [Post #206]

[shunyadragon]

Makes sense to me.

That is the problem. Yes our physical existence is just potentially eternal physical existence and Natural Law is the potentially eternal cause.