How much of Christianity came from Jesus, and how much came from other sources?

[Hypatia_Alexandria]

Given that Jesus was God the Son, he could probably speak any language he wanted. Just like the apostles did by the power of the Holy Spirit in Acts 2.

I was about to point that out, but H_A obviously demotes him to a simple peasant, so...

This inability on your parts to distinguish a flesh and blood Galilean Jew from a later theological construct leads to nothing but confusion.

[Cow Poke]

This inability on your parts to distinguish a flesh and blood Galilean Jew from a later theological construct leads to nothing but confusion.

It will be all cleared up for you when you stand before Him.

[Hypatia_Alexandria]

It's kinda like the "minorities are too stupid to get proper ID, so we can't have that requirement".

It is not to do with minorities being too stupid as you suggest here [and indeed rogue06 repeatedly suggests]. It is about cultural attitudes.

Many Galilean everyday country-folk were unlikely to have been overly enamoured of Hellenism and those who endorsed it, i.e. their Tetrarch [himself the scion of Idumean converts] and who, like his father, had been imposed on them by the same foreign power [Rome].

Hence there were several mass movements that arose among Jewish peasants in villages or town such as Emmaus, Bethlehem, and Sepphoris. These people rallied around charismatic leadership figures whom they considered as anointed kings of the Jews, and such movements occurred in all three principle regions of Jewish settlement in Palestine, namely Galilee, Perea, and Judaea. These also occurred at around the time when Jesus of Nazareth was likely to have been born or growing up. As a young boy he could not have been unaware of these movements and the way they had been brutally suppressed by those same Roman overlords and their Hellenised supporters. It also remains probable that he had family members who had been involved in such uprisings.

We also know from much later periods of history how stories [and songs] accrue around valiant [albeit defeated] insurrections against brutal imperial conquerors [think of the nationalists in Ireland].

[Cow Poke]

It is not to do with minorities being too stupid as you suggest here [and indeed rogue06 repeatedly suggests]. It is about cultural attitudes.

Many Galilean everyday country-folk were unlikely to have been overly enamoured of Hellenism and those who endorsed it, i.e. their Tetrarch [himself the scion of Idumean converts] and who, like his father, had been imposed on them by that same foreign power [Rome].

Hence there were several mass movements that arose among Jewish peasants in villages or town such as Emmaus, Bethlehem, and Sepphoris. These people rallied around charismatic leadership figures whom they considered as anointed kings of the Jews, and such movements occurred in all three principle regions of Jewish settlement in Palestine, namely Galilee, Perea, and Judaea. These also occurred at around the time when Jesus of Nazareth was likely to have been born or growing up. As a young boy he could not have been unaware of these movements and the way they had been brutally suppressed by those same Roman overlords and their Hellenised supporters. It also remains probable that he had family members who had been involved in such uprisings.

We also know from much later periods of history how stories [and songs] accrue around valiant [albeit defeated] insurrections against brutal imperial conquerors [think of the nationalists in Ireland].

Did you hear that whooooooshing sound as the point flew right over your head?

[Hypatia_Alexandria]

Did you hear that whooooooshing sound as the point flew right over your head?

The known historical situation seems to have completely by-passed you.

[Cow Poke]

The known historical situation seems to have completely by-passed you.

Laughing --- honey, tootsiedarlin, you were the one who went running off on a tangent not getting....


sheeeeesh!

[Hypatia_Alexandria]

Perhaps because the rebuilding of Sepphoris would have provided a handy source of income for a tekton from Nazareth.

Let me guess. His dear old mother packed his bait box every morning for him before he picked up his tool bag and set off for work.

I would also point out that tekton may not mean what you and others suppose it to mean.

From Geza Vermes' Jesus the Jew

Now those familiar with the language spoken by Jesus are acquainted with a metaphorical use of "carpenter" and "carpenter's son" in ancient Jewish writings. In Talmudic sayings the Aramaic noun denoting carpenter or craftsman [naggar] stands for a "scholar" or "learned man".

This is something that no carpenter, son of carpenters, can explain.

There is no carpenter, nor a carpenter's son, to explain it.

Thus, although no one can be absolutely sure that the sayings cited in the Talmud were current already in first-century AD Galilee, proverbs such as these are likely to be age-old. If so, it is possible that the charming picture of "Jesus the carpenter" may have to be buried and forgotten.

.

[One Bad Pig]

Did you hear that whooooooshing sound as the point flew right over your head?

Hey! She knows stuff! I'm sure the fact of Herod the Great's hated Edomite lineage was not lost on the Jews, his marriage to the last Hasmonean princess Miramne and rebuilding of the Temple notwithstanding.

What exactly that has to do with anyone learning (or not learning) Greek is rather less clear.

[Hypatia_Alexandria]

Hey! She knows stuff! I'm sure the fact of Herod the Great's hated Edomite lineage was not lost on the Jews, his marriage to the last Hasmonean princess Miramne

Do not forget Doris!

[tabibito]

Let me guess. His dear old mother packed his bait box every morning for him before he picked up his tool bag and set off for work.

I would also point out that tekton may not mean what you and others suppose it to mean.

From Geza Vermes' Jesus the Jew

Now those familiar with the language spoken by Jesus are acquainted with a metaphorical use of "carpenter" and "carpenter's son" in ancient Jewish writings. In Talmudic sayings the Aramaic noun denoting carpenter or craftsman [naggar] stands for a "scholar" or "learned man".

This is something that no carpenter, son of carpenters, can explain.

There is no carpenter, nor a carpenter's son, to explain it.

Thus, although no one can be absolutely sure that the sayings cited in the Talmud were current already in first-century AD Galilee, proverbs such as these are likely to be age-old. If so, it is possible that the charming picture of "Jesus the carpenter" may have to be buried and forgotten.

.

Vermes speaks of the use of naggar to denote not only a carpenter or mason, but a learned man, so you have Jesus' mother packing his bait box. Your antipathetic predilections seem to have gotten the better of you. However - assuming that Vermes is right - Jesus claiming that he was to make Simon (Cephas/Peter) a fisher of men might put Peter's supposed deficiencies in doubt. And Jesus might be considered a scholar's son, which would make him not an ignorant peasant.

[Sparko]

This inability on your parts to distinguish a flesh and blood Galilean Jew from a later theological construct leads to nothing but confusion.

Sorry about your confusion. Must be an atheist thing. Maybe if you actually READ the bible itself instead of merely books written about the bible? You are like a movie critic who never saw a movie but only reads reviews about it.

[Sparko]

Let me guess. His dear old mother packed his bait box every morning for him before he picked up his tool bag and set off for work.

I would also point out that tekton may not mean what you and others suppose it to mean.

From Geza Vermes' Jesus the Jew

Now those familiar with the language spoken by Jesus are acquainted with a metaphorical use of "carpenter" and "carpenter's son" in ancient Jewish writings. In Talmudic sayings the Aramaic noun denoting carpenter or craftsman [naggar] stands for a "scholar" or "learned man".

This is something that no carpenter, son of carpenters, can explain.

There is no carpenter, nor a carpenter's son, to explain it.

Thus, although no one can be absolutely sure that the sayings cited in the Talmud were current already in first-century AD Galilee, proverbs such as these are likely to be age-old. If so, it is possible that the charming picture of "Jesus the carpenter" may have to be buried and forgotten.

.

Did you just provide a source that said Jesus was a scholar and learned man?

another H_A own goal.

[Hypatia_Alexandria]

Vermes speaks of the use of naggar to denote not only a carpenter or mason, but a learned man, so you have Jesus' mother packing his bait box. Your antipathetic predilections seem to have gotten the better of you. However - assuming that Vermes is right - Jesus claiming that he was to make Simon (Cephas/Peter) a fisher of men might put Peter's supposed deficiencies in doubt. And Jesus might be considered a scholar's son, which would make him not an ignorant peasant.

My first and second sentences were intentionally jocular given that flights of fancy among some here seem to know no bounds!

Vermes postulates a possibility but as such this individual would have been learned in matters to do with Judaism not the Hellenistic world.

[Hypatia_Alexandria]

Sorry about your confusion. Must be an atheist thing. Maybe if you actually READ the bible itself instead of merely books written about the bible? You are like a movie critic who never saw a movie but only reads reviews about it.

You confuse a later theological construct with a flesh and blood individual. The two are not the same.

[Hypatia_Alexandria]

Did you just provide a source that said Jesus was a scholar and learned man?

another H_A own goal.

If he was it was to do with Judaism. I doubt he'd read Plato in the original Greek or Virgil in the original Latin.