13 Dead, 20 Wounded...

[Jedidiah]

I think a major issue is that while school shootings have great impact, they are not very frequent. Most schools will go many if not all of their years of operation without a school shooting. Because of this, some of the solutions you offer aren't very practical, especially since school budgets are so tight. . . . snip . . .

Today schools spend a large excess in administrative stuff, and less on practical education. Get the feds out of local schools and there is lots of money. This said, I find it sad that such security has become a real feasible need.

[rogue06]

I'd have to see an actual CNN screencap or something to believe that CNN so drastically altered an image like there. There'd be no upside to doing so. I'd think, at worst, a CNN-tern grabbed a picture circulating around reddit or something.

Media outlets are portraying the shooter as having white supremacist leanings because he apparently used variations of "ironcross" as his username on social media sites.

Probably not the left-wing conspiracy you're envisioning, here.

To be honest I would like to see if the story gets picked up by major news outlets myself. But there is a history here. The way that the media portrayed George Zimmerman as being white and when noted that he has Hispanic heritage changed it to be a "white Hispanic" is one example. And how USA Today manipulated a photo of Condoleezza Rice to make her look demonic, which they later pulled and only got press coverage after they pulled it.

[The Thinker]

Christians make up over 75% of the population (at least people who call themselves Christians), so I would imagine that 75% of the population, is going to part of the 'vast majority' of violence. Imagine that. Anything else stupid you'd like to say today 'thinker'?

Christians make up only 70% of the US population. It's dropping about a percentage point per year. Amen!

The point is, Christianity is not making Christians not commit crimes by and large. Atheists are far under represented in terms of their percentage in the US compared to their percentage of criminals.

[Sam]

Regarding the claim that Umpqua Community College is a gun free zone:

Source: Umpqua Community College not a gun-free zone: Oregon laws prevent that. Betsy Hammond. The Oregonian. 2015.10.02

Umpqua Community College, site of a mass shooting Thursday, bans guns, knives longer than 4 inches and other weapons from campus.


But that policy has one big exemption that renders the pastoral 100-acre campus near Roseburg anything but a gun-free zone: Everyone with a concealed firearms license is allowed to bring guns on campus.


That is because a 1989 Oregon law forbids any public body except the Legislature from restricting the rights of concealed weapons permit-holders to bring guns where they wish.

...

John Parker, a 36-year-old Army veteran studying to become a drug and alcohol counselor, is among the UCC students who hold weapons permits and bring guns to campus. He had his gun and his license with him on campus Thursday when the shooting took place.


He was in the college's veterans center, just a few buildings away from Synder Hall, with some other students who were similarly permitted and armed, he told The Oregonian/OregonLive.


A college employee talked them out of leaving to try to use their guns to save others. The active shooter could have taken them down first. Law enforcement officers already on the scene would not have known their guns would be used to defend students and instructors, not hurt them, he said.


"If we would have run across the field, we would have been targets," he said. "We made a good choice at the time."

© Copyright Original Source

[Cow Poke]

Regarding the claim that Umpqua Community College is a gun free zone:

Source: Umpqua Community College not a gun-free zone: Oregon laws prevent that. Betsy Hammond. The Oregonian. 2015.10.02

Umpqua Community College, site of a mass shooting Thursday, bans guns, knives longer than 4 inches and other weapons from campus.


But that policy has one big exemption that renders the pastoral 100-acre campus near Roseburg anything but a gun-free zone: Everyone with a concealed firearms license is allowed to bring guns on campus.


That is because a 1989 Oregon law forbids any public body except the Legislature from restricting the rights of concealed weapons permit-holders to bring guns where they wish.

...

John Parker, a 36-year-old Army veteran studying to become a drug and alcohol counselor, is among the UCC students who hold weapons permits and bring guns to campus. He had his gun and his license with him on campus Thursday when the shooting took place.


He was in the college's veterans center, just a few buildings away from Synder Hall, with some other students who were similarly permitted and armed, he told The Oregonian/OregonLive.


A college employee talked them out of leaving to try to use their guns to save others. The active shooter could have taken them down first. Law enforcement officers already on the scene would not have known their guns would be used to defend students and instructors, not hurt them, he said.


"If we would have run across the field, we would have been targets," he said. "We made a good choice at the time."

© Copyright Original Source

That is my biggest concern about concealed carry holders carrying on campus - that first responders would have to sort out "who's the bad guys", and it could be a real detriment to focusing on the active shooter. If a situation occurs where the concealed carry holder already is, that's a different situation - but no cop wants to see "people with guns" running in an active shooter scenario.

[klaus54]

Christians make up only 70% of the US population. It's dropping about a percentage point per year. Amen!

The point is, Christianity is not making Christians not commit crimes by and large. Atheists are far under represented in terms of their percentage in the US compared to their percentage of criminals.

Schmuck.

[Starlight]

Christians make up only 70% of the US population. It's dropping about a percentage point per year.

Yeah, what surprises me is how recently it's started doing that in the US. New Zealand and the UK have been dropping at that rate for decades, and the rate show no signs of changing anytime soon. One study recently found pretty consistent such rates of change across 9 different Western countries, and predicted that religion will eventually vanish from those countries. Whereas in the US the rise of irreligion has occurred at a much much slower rate until very recently.

Atheists are far under represented in terms of their percentage in the US compared to their percentage of criminals.

I think you meant that the other way around!

[lilpixieofterror]

Christians make up only 70% of the US population. It's dropping about a percentage point per year. Amen!

Christianity is becoming less of a social club, so we're naturally going to see drops in people claiming to be social Christians. For calling yourself 'the thinker' you sure keep showing a total lack of thinking skills.

The point is, Christianity is not making Christians not commit crimes by and large. Atheists are far under represented in terms of their percentage in the US compared to their percentage of criminals.

You mean people who treat Christianity as a social club are not effected by the values it teaches? Amazing, isn't it? Don't worry though, as the social Christians leave their social club behind and start to become atheist, you'll start seeing rises in crime among atheist too. Again, for calling yourself 'the thinker', you sure keep showing a total lack of thinking.

[lilpixieofterror]

Schmuck.

He's a classic fundy atheist since the CIA factbook doesn't seem to show a 1% drop in numbers every year. Besides, as Christianity is becoming less of a social club, I'd expect to see drops in numbers of people claiming to be Christians.

[lilpixieofterror]

Yeah, what surprises me is how recently it's started doing that in the US. New Zealand and the UK have been dropping at that rate for decades, and the rate show no signs of changing anytime soon. One study recently found pretty consistent such rates of change across 9 different Western countries, and predicted that religion will eventually vanish from those countries. Whereas in the US the rise of irreligion has occurred at a much much slower rate until very recently.

Fundy atheist amuse me so much, with their claims that don't match reality. What most fundy atheist tend to ignore (most likely because they want their dreams of a religion free society to become true) is that Christianity is becoming less of a social club and people are more and more claiming to be Christians not because it is 'socially acceptable' to be one, but because they actually believe what it teaches (you know, kind of like how you stopped pretending to be a Christian and let your true colors shine). Isn't it amazing as a religion becomes less of a social club, numbers of people who claim to be adherents to it, end up dropping? Again, fundy atheist keep showing a real lack of thinking.

I think you meant that the other way around!

You mean that people who just claim to be Christians, are not actually following what their religion teaches? Quite amazing. Besides, a person who supports murdering babies is hardly in the position to preach to anybody about morality. Unless of course, you recant from your belief that it should be ok to murder 3 month old infants you sick monster.

[Jedidiah]

For calling yourself 'the thinker' you sure keep showing a total lack of thinking skills.

snip

Again, for calling yourself 'the thinker', you sure keep showing a total lack of thinking.

This is pretty common among self styled "free thinkers." Their "thinking" is sort of like the liberal "tolerance." As long as you agree with them you are a bright person, but . . .

[rogue06]

Obama is going to Roseburg, Oregon to continue to, in his own words, "politicize" the shooting. The residents of the town have expressed their displeasure and say more gun laws are not the answer. The local newspaper is openly saying that he is "not welcome" and in an interview the publisher accused Obama of wanting to "stand on the corpses of our loved ones and make some kind of political point."

I guess it is fair to ask which stricter proposal would have stopped it. More stringent background checks? No. Longer waiting periods? Nope. Limits on the number of firearms you can purchase? Try again. Regulations requiring gun locks? Are you kidding?

[firstfloor]

Obama is going to Roseburg, Oregon to continue to, in his own words, "politicize" the shooting.

[Cow Poke]

This is not a political issue.

Then why does Obama boast that he NEEDS to politicize it?

[lilpixieofterror]

This is pretty common among self styled "free thinkers." Their "thinking" is sort of like the liberal "tolerance." As long as you agree with them you are a bright person, but . . .

Besides, his blog on his sig line contains an entry that he wrote on 3 Oct of this year that gives people tips for how to beat federal drug laws where he admits to taking illegal drugs before. Last I checked, it was illegal to do the drugs listed and it makes you a criminal if you do those drugs, so why does he complain about Christians being criminals when his own admission would make him one? As I've seen before though,

"One standard for me, another standard for thee."