COVID deaths still declining

[rogue06]

This is entire story line ( that covid deaths are higher because hospitals were paid to diagnose it ) is just so much balony. Lying about cause of death for gain is not some trivial act, and any doctor convicted of it could lose their medical license. What was done, pure and simple, and is done in other cases where ability to pay is a problem, is that hospitals received compensation for patients they had to treat due to covid. This is the government making it possible for hospitals to remain solvent or at least close to solvent as they were overwhelmed by covid patients needing critical care and many of them dying.

I guess you'd rather the hospitals just close their doors during the pandemic?

It is something that would have an extremely low risk of getting caught at (who is going to dig up the bodies of those not cremated to check?) as opposed to running a "pill mill" or a medical center that takes advantage of Medicaid and/or Medicare -- both of which Happens All The Time.

[seanD]

This is entire story line ( that covid deaths are higher because hospitals were paid to diagnose it ) is just so much balony. Lying about cause of death for gain is not some trivial act, and any doctor convicted of it could lose their medical license. What was done, pure and simple, and is done in other cases where ability to pay is a problem, is that hospitals received compensation for patients they had to treat due to covid. This is the government making it possible for hospitals to remain solvent or at least close to solvent as they were overwhelmed by covid patients needing critical care and many of them dying.

I guess you'd rather the hospitals just close their doors during the pandemic?

Elizabeth Lee Vliet and Ali Shultz calls it covid bounties...

Biden’s Bounty on Your Life: Hospitals’ Incentive Payments for COVID-19

Only correction to their article I see is the title solely blaming Biden, when it was Trump that initiated the policy.

[Mountain Man]

Thanks for providing another example. The study that the CDC director was quoting was a study of 1.2 million vaccinated people.

Right, and look at the point she's trying to make: because those people had multiple comorbidities, their deaths don't really count as China flu deaths; therefore, the vaccine didn't fail

Now, apply that same reasoning to the 94% we were discussing earlier and see where it takes you.

[Stoic]

Right, and look at the point she's trying to make: because those people had multiple comorbidities, their deaths don't really count as China flu deaths; therefore, the vaccine didn't fail

No, she didn't say that. And I'll bet you don't even feel guilty for misrepresenting her.

Her point was that if you have been vaccinated, and don't have pre-existing comorbidities, you're probably pretty safe.

Now, apply that same reasoning to the 94% we were discussing earlier and see where it takes you.

94% (of the total deaths) had COVID plus something else caused by COVID plus (in some cases) other pre-existing comorbidities.

I'd like to know where you think that is supposed to take me.

[Stoic]

Elizabeth Lee Vliet and Ali Shultz calls it covid bounties...

Biden’s Bounty on Your Life: Hospitals’ Incentive Payments for COVID-19

Only correction to their article I see is the title solely blaming Biden, when it was Trump that initiated the policy.

That's a great source if you're looking for COVID-19 misinformation. Mountain Man should take note.

[seanD]

That's a great source if you're looking for COVID-19 misinformation. Mountain Man should take note.

Anything is "covid misinformation" when it goes against the covid cult narrative.

[Stoic]

Anything is "covid misinformation" when it goes against the covid cult narrative.

It is "covid misinformation" when it goes against peer reviewed science.

[seanD]

It is "covid misinformation" when it goes against peer reviewed science.

May I see the study showing that hospitals aren't abusing covid patients based on financial incentives?

[oxmixmudd]

It is something that would have an extremely low risk of getting caught at (who is going to dig up the bodies of those not cremated to check?) as opposed to running a "pill mill" or a medical center that takes advantage of Medicaid and/or Medicare -- both of which Happens All The Time.

That is just ridiculous, not that someone somewhere might try it, but that it is happening at any scale with potential to skew covid mortality statistics. Indeed, that assumption is clearly contradicted by other measures. The data has consistently indicated that the death toll fom covid tends to be undercounted at best. And that data has been discussed here several times

[oxmixmudd]

Nearly every American who has died of coronavirus also suffered from other underlying diseases, recent Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) data reveal.

According to the CDC's latest update on COVID-19 fatalities, 94 percent of people who have died of the infection in the US had at least one pre-existing condition, such as obesity, high blood pressure or heart disease.

Coronavirus was the sole cause of death for just six percent of fatalities as of data published August 26.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/a...onditions.html

Basically, due to the fact the majority of people over 50 have at least one of your listed co-morbidities, you are saying being over 50 is a 'co-morbidity'.

It's a brain dead argument MM. Covid isn't less deadly just because it disproportionately kills older people People over 50 are still people, they still want to live, their deaths are still tragedies, especially when a simple vaccination is all that is required to significantly reduce covid's mortality.

[Roy]

That over 90% of US COVID deaths involved co-morbidities such as asthma, high blood pressure or obesity, is true.
That over 90% of US COVID deaths "actually had other causes" is not true.

Dying from a comorbidity would be considered a different cause of death, dummy.

So you think that every single one of the people who had comorbidities listed alongside COVID on their death certificates died of a non-COVID related comorbidity, and that none of them died of COVID or a complication caused by COVID.

I'm being called "ignorant" by a total moron.

[Stoic]

May I see the study showing that hospitals aren't abusing covid patients based on financial incentives?

I was referring primarily to the website. As for the article itself, it suggests that remdesivir is bad for covid-19 patients, while ivermectin is good for them. Do you really need to see links to studies about that?

[seanD]

I was referring primarily to the website. As for the article itself, it suggests that remdesivir is bad for covid-19 patients, while ivermectin is good for them. Do you really need to see links to studies about that?

That was but a small drop in the bucket of incentive abuses...

The hospital payments include:

• A “free” required PCR test in the Emergency Room or upon admission for every patient, with government-paid fee to hospital.
• Added bonus payment for each positive COVID-19 diagnosis.
• Another bonus for a COVID-19 admission to the hospital.
• A 20 percent “boost” bonus payment from Medicare on the entire hospital bill for use of remdesivir instead of medicines such as Ivermectin.
• Another and larger bonus payment to the hospital if a COVID-19 patient is mechanically ventilated.
• More money to the hospital if cause of death is listed as COVID-19, even if patient did not die directly of COVID-19.
• A COVID-19 diagnosis also provides extra payments to coroners.

Nice try though. The ones in bold is especially the one I'd like to see a study disproving if you can kindly link me to it.

[Mountain Man]

No, she didn't say that.

It's what she was clearly implying. Here's the exact quote: "The overwhelming number of deaths, over 75 percent, occurred in people who had at least four comorbidities. So really, these were people who were unwell to begin with." In other words, they don't really count as China flu deaths because they "were unwell to begin with", so the vaccine didn't fail, those people already had one foot in the grave.

So like I said, apply that same reasoning to the 94% who died from comorbidities and see where it takes you.

[Mountain Man]

So you think that every single one of the people who had comorbidities listed alongside COVID on their death certificates died of a non-COVID related comorbidity, and that none of them died of COVID or a complication caused by COVID.

I'm being called "ignorant" by a total moron.

Hey, man, take it up with the CDC. I'm just the messenger.