Ahmaud Arbery; racist killing and attempted cover up.

[Diogenes]

Some rather interesting stuff has come out in the Arbery case. Turns out, Mr "Jogging while black" had a long history of using "Oh I was jogging" to cover for scoping out places and stealing things. Indeed, in local convenience stores, he became notorious as 'the jogger' for going to convenience stores in jogging clothes, stretching and limbering up outside, and then going inside, grabbing something(s) and running out without paying.

From the court docs:

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Prior acts, including a crime that happened the night before, aren't grounds for citizen's arrest.

[Diogenes]

And before the hand wringers enter the thread again, let me just say that no, these facts in and of themselves do not justify Arbury being shot. But the facts do give us some insight into his character and why he would attack someone armed with a shotgun.

Edit: Too late.

If you're being chased down by a group of three people in a vehicle in which one individual is armed, that's not much recourse outside of attempting to disarm the individual who's armed in an attempt at self-defence.

[Mountain Man]

Glad to know you recognize that. "in and of themselves" however is an unnecessary qualifier that casts shade on whether or not the killing was justified.

I see you are apparently continuing to deny the fact that Arbury was shot as a direct result of his own actions, and these latest facts inform us that his conduct on that day was not out of character. While this doesn't necessarily justify what happened, it does go a long ways towards explaining it and will make it a lot harder to get a conviction against the defendants.

[Mountain Man]

If you're being chased down by a group of three people in a vehicle in which one individual is armed, that's not much recourse outside of attempting to disarm the individual who's armed in an attempt at self-defence.

This is treading ground that was well covered in the opening pages of this thread, but the fact is, Arbery had any number of options available to him that did not involve closing a distance of 20-feet at a run and attempting to wrestle a shotgun away from the man confronting him. There's also the fact that if the men had simply wanted to shoot him in cold blood, they had ample opportunity to do so before he was right in their face forcing the situation into a literal matter of life and death.

[Diogenes]

This is treading ground that was well covered in the opening pages of this thread, but the fact is, Arbery had any number of options available to him that did not involve closing a distance of 20-feet at a run and attempting to wrestle a shotgun away from the man confronting him. There's also the fact that if the men had simply wanted to shoot him in cold blood, they had ample opportunity to do so before he was right in their face forcing the situation into a literal matter of life and death.

Seeing as there was a second vehicle behind Arbery, it's the attempt to wrestle the shotgun away was a flight or fight response. That aside, the 2019 GA statute only provides citizen's arrest for in when the offender is witnessed to have commit the crime or with immediate knowledge. If the offender is attempting to escape, it has to be a felony in order to justify the arrest. The citizen's arrest was unjustified by the statute, therefore any actions taken were a result of illegal activity.

It's felony murder. All the charges are appropriate.

[Cow Poke]

I see you are apparently continuing to deny the fact that Arbury was shot as a direct result of his own actions, and these latest facts inform us that his conduct on that day was not out of character. While this doesn't necessarily justify what happened, it does go a long ways towards explaining it and will make it a lot harder to get a conviction against the defendants.

Yes, if I decide to "run with the bulls" and one of them gores me, it can't possibly be my fault at all. It was 100% the bull that gored me.

[rogue06]

Prior acts, including a crime that happened the night before, aren't grounds for citizen's arrest.

But the trespassing would be sufficient.

[Diogenes]

Yes, if I decide to "run with the bulls" and one of them gores me, it can't possibly be my fault at all. It was 100% the bull that gored me.

The running of the bulls alludes to a voluntary action. Being chased by vigilantes isn't voluntary.

[Diogenes]

But the trespassing would be sufficient.

It would have to have been in their presence. Also, trespassing isn't a felony.

[Cow Poke]

The running of the bulls alludes to a voluntary action. Being chased by vigilantes isn't voluntary.

Yes, we're fully aware of that, but this "runner" had a long history of criminal activity, using "running" as his cover --- sadly, it finally caught up with him.
And regardless of how many times we say he did NOT deserve to be killed, the super-woke will always declare that considering ANY fact that doesn't support the "white vigilantes murdered the poor black man" is "blaming the victim".

[rogue06]

The running of the bulls alludes to a voluntary action. Being chased by vigilantes isn't voluntary.

But being chased as a result of skulking around private property with what now appears to be strong evidence of an intent to commit larceny is.

[oxmixmudd]

I see you are apparently continuing to deny the fact that Arbury was shot as a direct result of his own actions, and these latest facts inform us that his conduct on that day was not out of character. While this doesn't necessarily justify what happened, it does go a long ways towards explaining it and will make it a lot harder to get a conviction against the defendants.

As has been said over and over, being violently chased by armed men presents one with few options - trusting their goodwill not being one of them. You can find a way to escape - also not an option in this case as the video shows. You can just sit there and let them kill you or hope they decide not to, or you can fight and hope you prevail. Arbery chose the latter but unfortunately did not succeed and was killed.

[rogue06]

It would have to have been in their presence. Also, trespassing isn't a felony.

It's been awhile but IIRC it was in their presence.

Now if they had been smart they would have simply followed him as he left making no attempt to apprehend or confront but instead calling 9-1-1 and waiting for a cop to arrive.

[oxmixmudd]

But being chased as a result of skulking around private property with what now appears to be strong evidence of an intent to commit larceny is.

As I said, nothing there justifies an armed and violent (they hit him at least once) chase and the ensuing murder. Now - to those claiming that the post of Gondwanaland does not involve providing justification for at least the murderers' armed chase, your post is exhibit A to the contrary.

[Bill the Cat]

It would have to have been in their presence. Also, trespassing isn't a felony.

Not necessarily. "IMMEDIATE KNOWLEDGE" can be interpreted as the local police notifying them.