RIP #MeToo

[lilpixieofterror]

Your focus on the excess of the entertainment industry as some sort of measure of the truth or falsity of the correlation between Patriarchy and the abuse of women is misguided. That is a very small, and perverse, subset of our culture known for its excess and narcissism. Whatever 'political' views they align themselves with, their lifestyles and actions are often simply not representative of the culture as a whole.

A very large overview of the effect of Patriarchy to egalitarian can be seen in this map of the relative security of women:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Domest...compressed.jpg

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It you overlay that map with societies that are more egalitarian vs more patriarchal, or equivalently governments that enforce laws that guarantee equal rights to women vs those that do not

https://i1.wp.com/www.doublexeconomy...compressed.jpg

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the correlation is obvious. But a more fine grained analysis of the research will have to wait for me to have a little more time available to gather it and present it.

What is the majority religion, of the worst abusers? What is their race? What is their incomes?

We can draw lots of conclusions Jim, even some pretty racist and religious bigoted ones at that. You should know better than to assume your premise. We can infer lots of stuff, based on your maps.

[oxmixmudd]

Your logic is all over the map. I said that - and have shown ample support of - patriarchal culture tends to foster or encourage the abuse of women.

So Islam is bad for women, correct?

More than islam is represented there Pix. Those maps show issues in Russian and China as well, also strongly patriarchal with poor laws enforcing equality for women, but NOT Islamic as a whole. India as well, which is majority (80%) Hindu.


The issue here is patriarchal vs egalitarian culture and its effects on the amount of abuse women suffer. Do patriarchical cultures have more female abuse? Yes. Does the conservative evangelical church which has an underlying patriarchal theology reflect that fact - yes, with qualifications as I have outlined them in my previous posts.

[lilpixieofterror]

You are the one trying to play off that. I never said that. I said that - and have shown ample support of - patriarchal culture tends to foster or encourage the abuse of women.

More than islam is represented there Pix. Those maps show issues in Russian and China as well, also strongly patriarchal with poor laws enforcing equality for women.

Also lots of:

Poverty
Non white people
And anarchy

Found in these areas of the world too. Interesting that you ignore those three things and choose the one you prefer.

The issue here is patriarchal vs egalitarian culture and its effects on the amount of abuse women suffer. Do patriarchical cultures have more female abuse? Yes. Does the conservative evangelical church which has an underlying patriarchal theology reflect that fact - yes, with qualifications as I have outlined them in my previous posts.

[oxmixmudd]

It's not "my map". They come mostly from women's organizations that try to analyse the inequalities women face worldwide, and there are a large number of such maps which focus in on more fine grained issues that have an effect.

One side point, though it should be obvious, but perhaps you haven't quite figured it out. Anarchy devolves to the powerful and aggressive rule. So trying to single out Anarchy as some other cause is ridiculous in that men are in general the stronger and the more aggressive and absent any sort of law means that Anarchy == and extreme form of Patriarchy pretty much all of the time.

[lilpixieofterror]

It's not "my map". They come mostly from women's organizations that try to analyse the inequalities women face worldwide, and there are a large number of such maps which focus in on more fine grained issues that have an effect.

One side point, though it should be obvious, but perhaps you haven't quite figured it out. Anarchy means the powerful rule. One of the reasons Patriarchy and the abuse of women is the focus is that men, absent the law, are in general the stronger and the more agressive - which means that Anarchy == Patriarchy most of the time.

[oxmixmudd]

Those are maps that show the correlation between womens security and the enforcement of egalitarian laws Pix. I'll wait to respond any further till I have other data to post, this current trend is just devolving into you having an endless supply of excuses to ignore the data.

[lilpixieofterror]

Those are maps that show the correlation between womens security and the enforcement of egalitarian laws Pix. You are just making up excuses to reject the hard data at this point.

[oxmixmudd]

The original statement is that the underlying patriarchical sytem that tends to be more rigidly held to by Conservative Christian Churches fosters or encourages (original word) the abuse of women. I have not deviated from that. There are two primary elements of analysis here.

1) do patriarchal systems tend to increase abuse over egalitarian systems.
2) is this effect seen in the church

I have addressed both of those questions with evidence in several different posts and am continuing to address both of those issues in discussion and with evidence. So no, I am not 'getting off the subject'.

[lilpixieofterror]

The original statement is that the underlying patriarchical sytem that tends to be more rigidly held to by Conservative Christian Churches fosters or encourages (original word) the abuse of women. I have not deviated from that. There are two primary elements of analysis here.

1) do patriarchal systems tend to increase abuse over egalitarian systems.
2) is this effect seen in the church

Have you proved either one, is true?

I have addressed both of those questions with evidence in several different posts and am continuing to address both of those issues in discussion and with evidence. So no, I am not 'getting off the subject'.

[oxmixmudd]

I've been quite successful so far in terms of making my case. However, convincing a person with strong opinions on the web is virtually impossible, and therefore isn't by itself a useful measure of the quality of the argument made.

[oxmixmudd]

The maps in question compare the relative safety of women to the existence of laws that require equal treatment of women. The correlation is virtually 100%, and most noteworthy in civilized, stable areas of the world where the possible exceptions you list do not apply. There is no doubt that in some of those places it is possible the primary issue is something other than unequal treatment under the law, but not all of them, and not those that are civilized areas of the world with stable governments. You're basically using special pleading, you'll need a large number of different reason that 'accidentally' correlated to egalitarian vs patriarchical.

However, I do not intend for those maps to serve anything more than anecdotal purpose at this point. They show the expected result under the hypothesis, but more is needed to make the case.

The maps do not have anything fine grained to say about churches in america. They show the correlation between patriarchal culture and abuse, they do not show the specific effect of patriarchal underpinings on abuse of women in the church itself. The previous paper talks about that specific application.

[lilpixieofterror]

I've been quite successful so far in terms of making my case. However, convincing a person with strong opinions on the web is virtually impossible, and therefore isn't by itself a useful measure of the quality of the argument made.

[lilpixieofterror]

The maps in question compare the relative safety of women to the existence of laws that require equal treatment of women. The correlation is virtually 100%, and most noteworthy in civilized, stable areas of the world where the possible exceptions you list do not apply. There is no doubt that in some of those places it is possible the primary issue is something other than unequal treatment under the law, but not all of them, and not those that are civilized areas of the world with stable governments. You're basically using special pleading, you'll need a large number of different reason that 'accidentally' correlated to egalitarian vs patriarchical.

However, I do not intend for those maps to serve anything more than anecdotal purpose at this point. They show the expected result under the hypothesis, but more is needed to make the case.

The maps do not have anything fine grained to say about churches in america. They show the correlation between patriarchal culture and abuse, they do not show the specific effect of patriarchal underpinings on abuse of women in the church itself. The previous paper talks about that specific application.

[oxmixmudd]

For this conversation to continue, you will need to stop trying to divine my motives and focus on facts and data.

[lilpixieofterror]

For this conversation to continue, you will need to stop trying to divine my motives and focus on facts and data.