Tucker Carlson, and comments on the history of FOX

[oxmixmudd]

In what way would acting decent be the problem in this case? It seems to me that what you describe are the opposite of that. So, again, how can your own decency be used against you?

Acting decent would never be a problem ... except that it makes indecent people uncomfortable.

Jim

[lilpixieofterror]

I tend to agree with you in principle. The issue here is that this was things said not in earshot of a single person but over the public airwaves on a popular, albeit bottom of the barrel, radio show. So it is a matter of public record. Second, since it is public record it is up to the public, not an individual, if it is a nothing or a something. If he gets through it, he'll more than likely be immune to it from this point on. It will always be out there to be discovered and used against him. The fact he said such things, if he is not sorry he said them, will always be a descriptor for who he is behind the scenes.

I've heard a lot worse too pix. But not from otherwise good people. I've heard it from the guys that will lay any girl available, married or not, assuming she is pretty enough to count as a notch in his ranking among such men.. From the folks that wind up with a DUI having drunk way to much at a party, or fooling around behind their wives backs, unless they grow out of it fairly early on.

People that carry on like carlson did are not basically good people unless it is just an immature phase that they quickly as they mature recognize is not who they want to be.

People who persist in this past the late teenage years or perhaps early 20's just usually are not good people has been my experience.

Jim

[oxmixmudd]

Of course I can understand a person can repent and become a completely different person than they once were. That doesn't mean their past will not haunt them or limit them. The principle of repentance involves accepting that sometimes the consequences of what we did stays with us a long time. Accepting that fact and accepting responsibility for those consequences is in fact part of what true repentance is. But sometimes those consequences can't be fixed in this lifetime, and the person must live with them.

Now in Carlson's case, has he shown he's sorry for what he said on that show? If we postulate he's a changed man, then surely he is sorry for what happened and will be glad to apologize for it. Now I would agree with you that some of what we may end up with in a case like that is an opportunistic refusal to acknowledge the evidence a person has changed. And that is truly sad when it happens. And, in fact, there is a lot of that going around, and in fact that is worth raising a voice about. but one of the hardest things about true repentance and true humility is understanding that those that have been wronged may not forgive us. It would be best for them if they did, but the reality is, justice does not require it.

Justice does however require the penalty fit the crime.

In a lot of what is happening in #metoo and other movements like that, people are being castigated for what they were, and no regard is being given to what they may have become. And that most certainly is wrong - as far as it can go. And many times the penalty for the offense is way out of line relative to the offense. But sometimes (e.g. if a crime was committed, and/or if the action was so heinous we can't take a chance on whether or not they have actually changed -- child molestation) - the consequences are in fact justly harsh and remain. A truly repentant person should be able to understand why they can't be given a pass in those cases.

In the Jewish tradition which Christ amplifies God forgives our sin, but WE are required to make restitution to those we have hurt. Christ says if we are in prayer and remember a person who has something against us, we are to first go to them and make it right, then return for prayer. God's forgiveness, Gods redemption does not release us from our obligations to our fellow humans to attempt to repair what we have broken unless those same people we have hurt also release us from that obligation.

True repentance incorporates these elements. A person that did something wrong and says they've repented but who refuses to work to make amends has not understood either repentance or forgiveness.



Jim

[Cow Poke]

Of course I can understand a person can repent and become a completely different person than they once were. That doesn't mean their past will not haunt them or limit them. The principle of repentance involves accepting that sometimes the consequences of what we did stays with us a long time. Accepting that fact and accepting responsibility for those consequences is in fact part of what true repentance is. But sometimes those consequences can't be fixed in this lifetime, and the person must live with them.

Jim

Can I amen that part?

I get SO TIRED of these preachers who say "All you have to do is accept Jesus and ALL your troubles go away!" No, they DON'T -- and sometimes, becoming a Christian brings NEW problems or challenges...

So, yeah, a guy serving time for armed robbery becomes a Christian, and the warden doesn't stop by his cell and say "hey, congrats on being a Christian, you can go home to your family!"

so, yes, there are often still consequences of our sin, even though the ultimate consequence of our sin has been removed.

[rogue06]

Can I amen that part?

I get SO TIRED of these preachers who say "All you have to do is accept Jesus and ALL your troubles go away!" No, they DON'T -- and sometimes, becoming a Christian brings NEW problems or challenges...

So, yeah, a guy serving time for armed robbery becomes a Christian, and the warden doesn't stop by his cell and say "hey, congrats on being a Christian, you can go home to your family!"

so, yes, there are often still consequences of our sin, even though the ultimate consequence of our sin has been removed.

God never said that the journey would be easy, but He did say that the arrival would be worthwhile

[NorrinRadd]

Everyone changes with time, so I presume in some sense Tucker is not "the same person" he was ten years ago. I suspect he is also not radically different. I suspect his attitude is much closer to, "Eh, probably could have been a bit more circumspect. Whatever" than to "Oh, woe is me, I must rend my garments and repent in sackcloth and ashes! I am but a worm!"

I will dare to say that it is better to ignore the Ned Flanders Christian stereotype of rushing to be conciliatory in cases like this. It gives power to the bullies, and is akin to negotiating with terrorists.