Covid question

[JimboJSR]

I guess I'm not enough of a conspiracy theory aficionado to think they put those tents in the parking lot just to fool me into thinking the pandemic is worse than it is.

If anyone is interested: the "video segments" he mentions seem largely to consist of people filming in the corridors, which were empty, owing to no visitors being allowed due to the horribly contagious disease we were battling. According to these intrepid reporters of the truth, if the hospital coffee shop isn't fullof beds with sick people on oxygen, the hospital is "empty". The conspiracy loons did on occasion try to film in wards, which is NEVER allowed (apart from strictly controlled circumstances) for pretty obvious reasons of patient confidentiality.

RE: unused tents. I should also point out that in the UK we converted a few large conference centers in major cities to makeshift field "Nightingale" hospitals, in case the main hospitals overflowed. In the event, we didn't need them, and they are now all closed. The only reason we didn't ned them was because basically EVERYTHING in the normal hospitals was taking covid, and lockdowns managed to stem the tide. So we managed without them, but at great cost. (Just as well, as thanks to incompetent political management of the NHS over the last decade, we barely had the staff to run the Nightingale hospitals anyway).

EDIT - I have whitney on ignore, so all I can see of him are quotes in other peoples posts. Spose I should really ignore them before I start looking like John Loftus every time he promised to leave, and came scurrying back for more 10 minutes later.

EDIT #2 - Here's a pretty heartbreaking account of a young UK doc who spent his day working his butt off to help sick people, only to walk outside to a crowd who were telling HIM that the patients he was treating didn't exist. Just insane. https://twitter.com/mbklee_/status/1344795588039208961

[Machinist]

I don't think people are dumb who get the vaccine. I don't think it's a thoughtless choice. They're just concerned for their health.

[JimboJSR]

They're just concerned for their health.

And the health of others. It's highly likely that a successful covid vaccine, like most vaccines, will reduce the chances of me spreading covid to other people.

[mikewhitney]

I don't think people are dumb who get the vaccine. I don't think it's a thoughtless choice. They're just concerned for their health.

It is a panic response. Also, many people get the idea that they will gain freedom and safety from the experimental shots. Ironically, a survey showed that those who get the shots are less likely to return to normal life than those who do not. In all likelihood, the governments will see other miraculous outbreaks and will demand more of the ineffective lockdowns and promote more economic collapse of each of the nations. I posted where the EU had already planned passports for 2021.

As to being a thoughtless decision, it really is. Few people are doing like yourself ... about asking questions about the covid shots before getting them.

[mikewhitney]

If anyone is interested: the "video segments" he mentions seem largely to consist of people filming in the corridors, which were empty, owing to no visitors being allowed due to the horribly contagious disease we were battling. According to these intrepid reporters of the truth, if the hospital coffee shop isn't fullof beds with sick people on oxygen, the hospital is "empty". The conspiracy loons did on occasion try to film in wards, which is NEVER allowed (apart from strictly controlled circumstances) for pretty obvious reasons of patient confidentiality.

RE: unused tents. I should also point out that in the UK we converted a few large conference centers in major cities to makeshift field "Nightingale" hospitals, in case the main hospitals overflowed. In the event, we didn't need them, and they are now all closed. The only reason we didn't ned them was because basically EVERYTHING in the normal hospitals was taking covid, and lockdowns managed to stem the tide. So we managed without them, but at great cost. (Just as well, as thanks to incompetent political management of the NHS over the last decade, we barely had the staff to run the Nightingale hospitals anyway).

EDIT - I have whitney on ignore, so all I can see of him are quotes in other peoples posts. Spose I should really ignore them before I start looking like John Loftus every time he promised to leave, and came scurrying back for more 10 minutes later.

EDIT #2 - Here's a pretty heartbreaking account of a young UK doc who spent his day working his butt off to help sick people, only to walk outside to a crowd who were telling HIM that the patients he was treating didn't exist. Just insane. https://twitter.com/mbklee_/status/1344795588039208961

It would be nice if jimbo was not hiding from discussion. He might be able to tell what treatments were being used or when the loading was happening. He may be able to describe how patients arrived at hospitals when there was no activity outside during long hours of the day as people filmed. A normal hospital should have activity in its hallways for people moving around with prescriptions and doing roving services. It is possible that some of the hospitals were busy. It is possible that some UK hospitals actually helped patients recover. But all that is normally shared are the staged scenes -- which are contradicted by the independent reporters even the next day -- showing total inactivity.

I could be interested in his broader testimony since I am not trying to obscure his testimony. However, he just has not testified to much. If he had done the research, I could not imagine him recommending the experimental covid shots -- using a technology that has harmed animals in tests over the years. We have counter testimonies where doctors said they did not have much work to do in their shifts.

The problem, if nothing else, is that the patterns of evidence simply are not convincing that this covid fiasco was handled right by medical groups or by governments.

[Teallaura]

Ha Ha. PanicDemic. I like that!

Obviously I don't have the means to run complicated morphology analysis, and can only rely on second hand sources from minds that I deem credible. I do the best I can within limitations.

My gut intuition combined with what little data I have been able to digest and assimilate give me confidence that I will be fine. Then there is the question "but what about others that you might infect?"

My question to that question is " where does this end?"

I take a vaccine, then what? Wait for the next virus to come around and the next variant and the next and the next?

People need to understand how maps of reality form, and what and how things get filtered though and incorporated into that map and what gets filtered out. The average person does not have time to do extensive research, and they base their map on what they see and then take cues from other minds who verify and confirm what they are seeing. I live in such a self verifying population.

Okay, full disclosure - I didn't read all of your post (my eyes are killing me!). I'm answering only one small point.

If you are asymptomatic you are either NOT infected, or infected WITHOUT symptoms. BOTH of those translate to NOT INFECTIOUS.

Basically, unless you have symptoms, AND have C19, you are not 'protecting' anyone from C19 in ANY WAY WHATSOEVER.

You cannot give someone something you DON'T have - and asymptomatic spread is NOT a thing with C19 - in other words, if you don't have symptoms, you can't spread C19 even if you actually are infected.

And yes, that means that political solutions are BAD solutions in public health matters.

[Machinist]

and asymptomatic spread is NOT a thing with C19 - in other words, if you don't have symptoms, you can't spread C19 even if you actually are infected.

.

Wow. That's interesting that you said that.

[Teallaura]

Wow. That's interesting that you said that.

It's just a blunt statement of the CDC's findings.

[mikewhitney]

And the health of others. It's highly likely that a successful covid vaccine, like most vaccines, will reduce the chances of me spreading covid to other people.

The problem here is that Jimbo assumes points not in evidence. This is not anything like previous vaccines so nothing can be assumed due to the supposed history of vaccines. The current covid shots are based on a new technology that has not been tested before. Plus, we are getting some accounts of women having extreme periods even without being vaxxed but being around people who got the experimental covid shots. The mechanism of this transfer is not understood yet.

[Stoic]

And the health of others. It's highly likely that a successful covid vaccine, like most vaccines, will reduce the chances of me spreading covid to other people.

Yes, and there is also the consideration that if too few people get vaccinated, the pandemic will rage on much longer, increasing the chances that a new variant will come along that the vaccines can't handle.

[Machinist]

The mechanism of this transfer is not understood yet.

I am not comfortable with it.

[rogue06]

If you take seriously the idea that the pandemic may not be real, then you owe it to yourself to consider why so many people in the media and the government are adamant that it's real.

That is probably not the best approach to take given what we just experienced with things like the Collusion Delusion where "so many people in the media and the government are adamant that it's real" and many remain so

[JimboJSR]

It's just a blunt statement of the CDC's findings.

Linky?

[Sparko]

The problem here is that Jimbo assumes points not in evidence. This is not anything like previous vaccines so nothing can be assumed due to the supposed history of vaccines. The current covid shots are based on a new technology that has not been tested before. Plus, we are getting some accounts of women having extreme periods even without being vaxxed but being around people who got the experimental covid shots. The mechanism of this transfer is not understood yet.

Being that Jimbo is an ACTUAL Medical Doctor who has dealt with the disease first hand and actually understands how disease and vaccines work, I will take his word over your conspiracy theories any day. Your "evidence" is mostly misinterpreting the actual data, and relying on antivax websites for skewed "reports" by antivax quacks.

[Teallaura]

CDC MMWR

It was reported multiple times in the media but I just went straight to the CDC. I've seen much more direct statements but this was the first one at hand.

Seriously, if asymptomatic spread was a major vector the infection rate would be significantly higher.