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Welcome to Comp Religions, this is where the sights and sounds of the many world religions come together in a big World's Fair type atmosphere, without those delicious funnel cakes.
World Religions is a theist only type place, but that does not exclude certain religionists who practice non-theistic faiths ala Buddhism. If you are not sure, ask a moderator.
This is not a place where we argue the existence / non-existence of God.
And as usual, the forum rules apply.
Forum Rules: Here
World Religions is a theist only type place, but that does not exclude certain religionists who practice non-theistic faiths ala Buddhism. If you are not sure, ask a moderator.
This is not a place where we argue the existence / non-existence of God.
And as usual, the forum rules apply.
Forum Rules: Here
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Unitarian Universalism
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High fog index. Try a dictionary. Maybe even common sense. "Transformation of social structures and institutions ...," that might be something the International House of Justice or the Vatican could reflect on--if they wanted to be open to a little revelation.אָכֵ֕ן אַתָּ֖ה אֵ֣ל מִסְתַּתֵּ֑ר אֱלֹהֵ֥י יִשְׂרָאֵ֖ל מוֹשִֽׁיעַ׃
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Originally posted by robrecht View PostHigh fog index. Try a dictionary. Maybe even common sense. "Transformation of social structures and institutions ...," that might be something the International House of Justice or the Vatican could reflect on--if they wanted to be open to a little revelation.
As described the Universal [not International] House of Justice and the Baha'i Faith as a whole does consult on 'change' as in science, and the evolving body of scientific knowledge as a form of revelation. Probably all religions and faiths involve some form of 'Theological, or Philosophical Reflection,' even UUs, but the purpose as defined is not Revelation, nor change in Doctrine nor Dogma of the foundation of the belief systems..Last edited by shunyadragon; 10-23-2014, 07:25 AM.
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Originally posted by shunyadragon View PostI am doing exactly that. I refer to authorities that provide good concise definitions, which represents good common sense. Yes, the problem is you are creating the High Fog Index by presenting a confusing description of 'Theological Reflection, which is not how it is used. I can provide several more references, but I doubt it would help.
As described the Universal [not International] House of Justice and the Baha'i Faith as a whole does consult on 'change' as in science, and the evolving body of scientific knowledge as a form of revelation. Probably all religions and faiths involve some form of 'Theological, or Philosophical Reflection,' even UUs, but the purpose as defined is not Revelation, nor change in Doctrine nor Dogma of the foundation of the belief systems..אָכֵ֕ן אַתָּ֖ה אֵ֣ל מִסְתַּתֵּ֑ר אֱלֹהֵ֥י יִשְׂרָאֵ֖ל מוֹשִֽׁיעַ׃
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Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post... Universal [not International] House of Justice ...אָכֵ֕ן אַתָּ֖ה אֵ֣ל מִסְתַּתֵּ֑ר אֱלֹהֵ֥י יִשְׂרָאֵ֖ל מוֹשִֽׁיעַ׃
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Originally posted by robrecht View PostOops, sorry, I read that once on the Baha'i library website and it just seemed to stick, sounds too much like the International House of Pancakes! Is the original language for the name of this body Arabic? Happen to know the actual terms used?
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Originally posted by robrecht View PostI think you are missing my point. I am using the terms 'theological reflection' in a very normal sense of those terms.
I do not think that its purpose is to be some kind of revelation or to change doctrine,
nonetheless it certainly has contributed to the development of doctrine in the Christian tradition.
In my discussions with you, you have presented some spiritual laws that you say cannot change without a new revelation, eg, the religious leadership of women.
This is somewhat different from what has occurred and is still occurring in the Christian tradition. For example, you attribute the rejection of slavery to a new Revelation, whereas other religions did not need to attribute such progress to a new Revelation contained in new Holy Scriptures.
Your criticism of Christianity sometimes seems to presume that Christians must share your own literalist view of some fixed spiritual laws that cannot change without a new revelation.
Never said the literalist rule in either my own nor any particular view. I did say that 50% or more of all Christians in America reject evolution and that is pretty consistent without much change in recent years.
Certainly many Christian fundamentalists do share your approach, but many do not and you prefer not to acknowledge or discuss those approaches found within the Christian tradition.
It is also ironic that you will not acknowledge this same weakness when it is found in your own view of Revelation. You would prefer not to discuss those examples. If that is not true, prove me wrong and be willing to discuss your own views of Revelation from the same critical perspective that you direct toward other religions.Last edited by shunyadragon; 10-23-2014, 07:55 PM.
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Originally posted by Spartacus View Postis this about baha'i stuff or unitarian universalism?Last edited by shunyadragon; 10-24-2014, 07:42 AM.
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Originally posted by shunyadragon View PostNo you have not, nor have you cited a source using it that way
Originally posted by shunyadragon View PostBack peddling, yes you did.
Originally posted by shunyadragon View PostYou are contradicting your above statement.
Originally posted by shunyadragon View PostI was not as specific at this as you claim. I actually do not know how things will be changed in the future, nor how the revelation in this case would be.
Originally posted by shunyadragon View PostThe opposition to slavery in Christianity has been too inconsistent, and violent, because Bible scripture still endorses slavery without any clear guidance of the rejection of slavery. This remains the problem for many conflicting and contradictory issues in the modern world.
Originally posted by shunyadragon View PostThe revelation of the absolute spiritual law against slavery was revealed in the Baha'i scripture and now is the international standard. Yes it is somewhat different between the Baha'i Faith and Christian tradition.
Originally posted by shunyadragon View PostThere is not much change in Christianity except for more churches and sects teaching inconsistent beliefs. The fundamental Doctrines and Dogma Christianity is set in Old World archaic concrete and will not change. It still remains that 50% or more of the Christians in the USA reject the science of evolution (46% of the whole population). There is too much division rejection of science, and clinging to ancient beliefs such as the Fall and Original Sin for their to be any significant leadership for the world for true change.
Sometime seems . . . makes assumptions about my view that are incorrect.
Never said the literalist rule in either my own nor any particular view. I did say that 50% or more of all Christians in America reject evolution and that is pretty consistent without much change in recent years.
Originally posted by shunyadragon View PostThey just make up more then 50% of the Christians in this country, and remain an unchanged force in Christianity. No I never said this represents all Christians. The clinging to absolute no change in the basic doctrines and dogma of Christianity does represent by far the majority and the only change here results in more churches, based on archaic ancient literature, does come around and bite those seeking change, because the apostles and the Church fathers believed in the literal Bible, and Christian Theocracy.
I could hardly be able to prove anything from your stone wall perspective. The Baha'i Faith acknowledges 'change in many things like science where there is impossible consensus in the confusion in Christian churches.אָכֵ֕ן אַתָּ֖ה אֵ֣ל מִסְתַּתֵּ֑ר אֱלֹהֵ֥י יִשְׂרָאֵ֖ל מוֹשִֽׁיעַ׃
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Originally posted by Spartacus View Postis this about baha'i stuff or unitarian universalism?אָכֵ֕ן אַתָּ֖ה אֵ֣ל מִסְתַּתֵּ֑ר אֱלֹהֵ֥י יִשְׂרָאֵ֖ל מוֹשִֽׁיעַ׃
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Originally posted by robrecht View PostIt started out in this thread about my advice to you as to the the liklihood that Shuny would address the history of Christian theology as opposed to his standard critique, which is ironically enough never directed toward his own beliefs in a self-critical fashion. It originally began in a few other threads, especially one of his own threads in which Shuny argued that theism, which he laters restricted to Christian theism, was contrary to freedom of thought. He abandonded that thread, his own thread, I believe because he was shown to be contradicting himself on this point, and, in his own words, because it became 'muddled'. One of the items with which it became muddled was an argument he was having about Unitarian Universalism; so he started this thread rather than continue his participation in his other thread. I have also tried to discuss this issue with him in a thread on Revelation and in another of his threads on the Baha'i Faith. He is free to discuss this wherever he chooses, if he ever does choose to discuss this. My 'agenda' is merely to have this discussion with him whereever he so chooses.
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Originally posted by shunyadragon View PostYou would have to cite the Baha'i source to justify this. Your sarcasm was in equating UHJ with the International House of Pancakes.
The interpretation of the Guardian, functioning within his own sphere, is as authoritative and binding as the enactments of the International House of Justicehttp://bahai-library.com/uhj_election_infallibility_uhj'International House of Justice'http://bahaikipedia.org/Universal_House_of_JusticeInternational House of Justice will have been removed. For upon the National Houses of Justice of the East and the West devolves the task, in conformity with the explicit provisions of the Will, of electing directly the members of the International House of Justice.
http://reference.bahai.org/en/t/se/WOB/wob-3.html
So, if my good will is no longer in doubt, perhaps you can address my question: Is the original language for the name of this body Arabic? Happen to know the actual terms used?אָכֵ֕ן אַתָּ֖ה אֵ֣ל מִסְתַּתֵּ֑ר אֱלֹהֵ֥י יִשְׂרָאֵ֖ל מוֹשִֽׁיעַ׃
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