Originally posted by rogue06
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Here in the Philosophy forum we will talk about all the "why" questions. We'll have conversations about the way in which philosophy and theology and religion interact with each other. Metaphysics, ontology, origins, truth? They're all fair game so jump right in and have some fun! But remember...play nice!
Forum Rules: Here
Here in the Philosophy forum we will talk about all the "why" questions. We'll have conversations about the way in which philosophy and theology and religion interact with each other. Metaphysics, ontology, origins, truth? They're all fair game so jump right in and have some fun! But remember...play nice!
Forum Rules: Here
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Morally Wrong Behavior vs. What the Civil Government Should Prohibit
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Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s
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Originally posted by rogue06 View PostThe small farmers hated it for a variety of reasons. One of them was motivated by sheer self-interest, namely that they could not compete against slave labor.
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Originally posted by seer View PostHow do you know what the majority supported three, four, five hundred years ago? You have polls?
That is a complete falsehood - the three specific people that Shuny mentioned were Christians. Please list the Rational Humanists that led the abolition movement in America and the British empire. I will be waiting.[/quote]
. . .but they matntained slavery abroad in India for economic motivations. It is clear in the USA and the British Empire slavery was maintained when economically valuable.
What is it Tass? Either we follow the values of the day or we don't - make up your mind...
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Originally posted by seer View Post
You are full of it Tass...
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Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post
Christians were supposed to be the highest standard in an immoral world, and as a matter of fact they were not.Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s
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Originally posted by Tassman View PostAre you denying that the Confederate States of America fought a civil war to maintain slavery, despite being majority Christian, and subsequently maintained racial discrimination under the Jim Crow laws until being forced by the Civil Rights Act of 1964 and the Voting Rights Act of 1965, to reluctantly abandon these laws?Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s
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Originally posted by seer View PostI'm still waiting for your list of the Rational Humanists that led the abolition movement in America and the British empire.Last edited by shunyadragon; 02-08-2020, 09:48 PM.
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Originally posted by shunyadragon View PostThe Unitarians in particular transcendentalists like William Henry Furness and William Ware who were Deists and humanists, and I will cite others
Unitarianism (from Latin unitas "unity, oneness", from unus "one") is a Christian theological movement named for its belief that the God in Christianity is one person, as opposed to the Trinity (tri- from Latin tres "three") which in most other branches of Christianity defines God as one being in three persons: the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.[1] Unitarian Christians, therefore, believe that Jesus was inspired by God in his moral teachings, and he is a savior,[2][3] but he was not a deity or God incarnate. As is typical of dissenters, Unitarianism does not constitute one single Christian denomination, but rather refers to a collection of both existing and extinct Christian groups, whether historically related to each other or not, which share a common theological concept of the oneness nature of God.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unitarianism
So I do not think it is a leap to say that the beliefs of Furness and Ware were informed by the teachings of Christ. Furness wrote quite a bit about the moral teachings of Christ, though like Jefferson, did believe in the miracles in the New Testament. And can you cite where Furness and Ware claim to be Deists?Last edited by seer; 02-09-2020, 06:52 AM.Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s
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Originally posted by seer View PostUnitarians are not unbelievers, some were Deists some were classic theists some were Christian. The Unitarians pretty much let everyone in.
Unitarianism (from Latin unitas "unity, oneness", from unus "one") is a Christian theological movement named for its belief that the God in Christianity is one person, as opposed to the Trinity (tri- from Latin tres "three") which in most other branches of Christianity defines God as one being in three persons: the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.[1] Unitarian Christians, therefore, believe that Jesus was inspired by God in his moral teachings, and he is a savior,[2][3] but he was not a deity or God incarnate. As is typical of dissenters, Unitarianism does not constitute one single Christian denomination, but rather refers to a collection of both existing and extinct Christian groups, whether historically related to each other or not, which share a common theological concept of the oneness nature of God.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unitarianism
So I do not think it is a leap to say that the beliefs of Furness and Ware were informed by the teachings of Christ. Furness wrote quite a bit about the moral teachings of Christ, though like Jefferson, did believe in the miracles in the New Testament. And can you cite where Furness and Ware claim to be Deists?Last edited by shunyadragon; 02-09-2020, 03:32 PM.
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Originally posted by shunyadragon View PostYes, the Unitarians represent a diversity, but those I referred to were Deists and humanist, and if I cite more they will be Deist and humanist at that time.. I was selective of those I refer to.
Although many Enlightenment philosophers opposed slavery, it was Christian activists, attracted by strong religious elements, who initiated and organized an abolitionist movement. [1] Throughout Europe and the United States, Christians, usually from "un-institutional" Christian faith movements, not directly connected with traditional state churches, or "non-conformist" believers within established churches, were to be found at the forefront of the abolitionist movements...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_AbolitionismAtheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s
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Originally posted by seer View PostShuny where is your evidence that Furness and Ware were Deists? But let's put it so even you can understand:
Exactly what I have been saying...
https://books.google.com/books?id=bL...%22%22&f=false
It is from this book that refers to a number of Deist humanist Transcendentalists that are Unitarians. This reference also refers to the conflicts with Orthodox ministers in other churches and their conflicts. The Transcendentalist Ministers: Church Reform in the New England Renaissance By William R. Hutchison
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Originally posted by shunyadragon View PostThis reference describes them as Deists and Transcendental rational humanists along with other Unitarian ministers. I cannot c&p to show here, but you can read for yourself.
https://books.google.com/books?id=bL...%22%22&f=false
It is from this book that refers to a number of Deist humanist Transcendentalists that are Unitarians. This reference also refers to the conflicts with Orthodox ministers in other churches and their conflicts. The Transcendentalist Ministers: Church Reform in the New England Renaissance By William R. Hutchison
Again Shuny what don't you understand:
Although many Enlightenment philosophers opposed slavery, it was Christian activists, attracted by strong religious elements, who initiated and organized an abolitionist movement. [1] Throughout Europe and the United States, Christians, usually from "un-institutional" Christian faith movements, not directly connected with traditional state churches, or "non-conformist" believers within established churches, were to be found at the forefront of the abolitionist movements...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_AbolitionismAtheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s
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Originally posted by seer View PostAgain Shuny what don't you understand:
You are still neglecting the fact that slavery was endemic with Christianity in the world up until the 18-19th century. Yes 'some' Christians opposed slavery, but no there is nothing in the Bible that forbids any nor every form of slavery.Last edited by shunyadragon; 02-09-2020, 10:01 PM.
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Originally posted by shunyadragon View PostI understand your response very well and you are dodging the bullet. The Unitarian minister and early Unitarian church leaders I referred to were Transcendental Deists and rational humanists as referenced. please respond to that. You asked for early Rational humanist the were opponents of slavery in the early movements, and I provided that.
You are still neglecting the fact that slavery was endemic with Christianity in the world up until the 18-19th century. Yes 'some' Christians opposed slavery, but no there is nothing in the Bible that forbids any nor every form of slavery.
Again: "Although many Enlightenment philosophers opposed slavery, it was Christian activists, attracted by strong religious elements, who initiated and organized an abolitionist movement. [1] Throughout Europe and the United States, Christians, usually from "un-institutional" Christian faith movements."
And who exactly were the "Rational humanist" who were actually involved in the abolitionist movement? Names and references please.Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s
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