Belief does not make a thing true. But nothing that is true, evidence, evidence others have, conclusions from deductive reasoning, does not become one's knowledge unless it is believed.
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Philosophy 201 Guidelines
Cogito ergo sum
Here in the Philosophy forum we will talk about all the "why" questions. We'll have conversations about the way in which philosophy and theology and religion interact with each other. Metaphysics, ontology, origins, truth? They're all fair game so jump right in and have some fun! But remember...play nice!
Forum Rules: Here
Here in the Philosophy forum we will talk about all the "why" questions. We'll have conversations about the way in which philosophy and theology and religion interact with each other. Metaphysics, ontology, origins, truth? They're all fair game so jump right in and have some fun! But remember...play nice!
Forum Rules: Here
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What does it matter . . . ?
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. . . the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; . . . -- Romans 1:16 KJV
. . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3-4 KJV
Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1 KJV
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Originally posted by 37818 View Post. . .mere belief does not make anything true. . . .
It remain at issue, one does not have knowledge unless a thing is believed.. . . the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; . . . -- Romans 1:16 KJV
. . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3-4 KJV
Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1 KJV
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Originally posted by 37818 View PostIt remain at issue, one does not have knowledge unless a thing is believed.
Try and differentiate between empirical knowledge that is based on predictable verifiable objective evidence, and knowledge based on belief of philosophical and theological knowledge.
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Originally posted by Tassman View PostYou're going in circles. Again: What one believes is not necessarily knowledge. "Knowledge" requires acquaintance with demonstrable facts and verified truths,. . . the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; . . . -- Romans 1:16 KJV
. . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3-4 KJV
Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1 KJV
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Originally posted by shunyadragon View PostRing around the rosy pocket full of posy.
Try and differentiate between empirical knowledge that is based on predictable verifiable objective evidence, and knowledge based on belief of philosophical and theological knowledge.. . . the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; . . . -- Romans 1:16 KJV
. . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3-4 KJV
Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1 KJV
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Originally posted by Tassman View PostWithout support from demonstrable facts and verified truths such "knowledge" remains belief; it cannot be shown to be "fact".
"Facts" are pieces of objective verifiable evidence. I said, "empirical knowledge is based on predictable verifiable objective evidence." No it does not remain belief nor shown to be fact. New 'facts' can always be found to change and add to empirical knowledge. This is science. It is dependent on the correspondent theory of truth, where verification must be based on objective evidence.
Theological and philosophical knowledge is not necessarily based on objective verifiable evidence, and is considered under the coherence theory of truth. Though there may be 'facts' related to this knowledge objective evidence is not necessary.
To see more on the difference between the correspondence theory and coherence theory of truth see the Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy.
https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/t...spondence/#8.1 and
https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/truth-coherence/
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Originally posted by shunyadragon View PostThis does not reflect what I ever posted.
"Facts" are pieces of objective verifiable evidence. I said, "empirical knowledge is based on predictable verifiable objective evidence." No it does not remain belief nor shown to be fact. New 'facts' can always be found to change and add to empirical knowledge. This is science. It is dependent on the correspondent theory of truth, where verification must be based on objective evidence.
Theological and philosophical knowledge is not necessarily based on objective verifiable evidence, and is considered under the coherence theory of truth. Though there may be 'facts' related to this knowledge objective evidence is not necessary.
To see more on the difference between the correspondence theory and coherence theory of truth see the Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy.
https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/t...spondence/#8.1 and
https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/truth-coherence/
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Originally posted by Tassman View PostI was addressing 37818, and merely trying to draw the distinction between substantiated belief and unsubstantiated belief.
Good example proposing the question 'What does it matter . . . ?'Last edited by shunyadragon; 01-29-2018, 11:24 AM.
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Originally posted by Tassman View PostYou're going in circles. Again: What one believes is not necessarily knowledge. "Knowledge" requires acquaintance with demonstrable facts and verified truths,. . . the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; . . . -- Romans 1:16 KJV
. . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3-4 KJV
Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1 KJV
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Originally posted by shunyadragon View PostRing around the rosy pocket full of posy.
Try and differentiate between empirical knowledge that is based on predictable verifiable objective evidence, and knowledge based on belief of philosophical and theological knowledge.. . . the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; . . . -- Romans 1:16 KJV
. . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3-4 KJV
Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1 KJV
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Originally posted by 37818 View PostYes, a thing believed is not necessarily knowledge. What is it that you actually know that you do not believe? That is not possible not to know anything unless it is believed.
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Originally posted by Tassman View PostI am merely trying to draw the distinction between substantiated belief and unsubstantiated belief. Unsubstantiated belief is not knowledge-based it is faith-based.. . . the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; . . . -- Romans 1:16 KJV
. . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3-4 KJV
Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1 KJV
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