Red Letter Christianity

[One Bad Pig]

So, no.

This would have much of the same effect, TBH. It's a sort of ultra-Protestantism: it goes even further in rejecting tradition to discarding everything written about Jesus in the scriptures as well.

[NorrinRadd]

1) It provokes my angry vein... or... um... whatever... to see the "slice and dice, point-by-point" responding style attributed to Tweb, or worse, to some particular poster who is not me. I have been employing that style for well over a decade -- maybe even two -- hither and yon -- CARM; John Radcliffe's anti-CARM site AARM; Grace Centered; Irwin What's-his-face's "Christian Forums" site; Fighting Fundies, wherever.

2) Count me among those who doesn't have to pucker his sphincter, clench his teeth, and hold his nose regarding Trump. I don't freakin' care that he doesn't behave in a supposedly "Christ-like" way. In fact, I'm GLAD that he doesn't turn the other cheek or try to turn away wrath with a gentle answer. I'm justthisclose to thinking that a "proper" Christian can't be a good and effective POTUS.

3) I don't know about the "movement," but the term "Red Letter Christian" has been around quite a while. I reflexively react negatively to it. Whether intentional or not, it easily leads to the implication that the "words of Jesus" outweigh all others. But we don't have "the words of Jesus." We have the words God inspired various different authors to attribute to Jesus. As such, they are no greater or less than any other words God inspired authors to record. It's a mind-set preferred by fluffy socially liberal Christians.

Regarding the site itself, I immediately react negatively upon seeing "Social Justice" given prominence. More and more, I am convinced that to a huge extent, "social" justice is the exact opposite of "actual" justice.

[NorrinRadd]

I've recently been visiting some of the "Evangelical" blogs at "Patheos." Some of them -- I believe Susan Wright is one -- are the sorts of Evangelicals who are appalled at the support for Trump.

[Cerebrum123]

1) It provokes my angry vein... or... um... whatever... to see the "slice and dice, point-by-point" responding style attributed to Tweb, or worse, to some particular poster who is not me. I have been employing that style for well over a decade -- maybe even two -- hither and yon -- CARM; John Radcliffe's anti-CARM site AARM; Grace Centered; Irwin What's-his-face's "Christian Forums" site; Fighting Fundies, wherever.

2) Count me among those who doesn't have to pucker his sphincter, clench his teeth, and hold his nose regarding Trump. I don't freakin' care that he doesn't behave in a supposedly "Christ-like" way. In fact, I'm GLAD that he doesn't turn the other cheek or try to turn away wrath with a gentle answer. I'm justthisclose to thinking that a "proper" Christian can't be a good and effective POTUS.

3) I don't know about the "movement," but the term "Red Letter Christian" has been around quite a while. I reflexively react negatively to it. Whether intentional or not, it easily leads to the implication that the "words of Jesus" outweigh all others. But we don't have "the words of Jesus." We have the words God inspired various different authors to attribute to Jesus. As such, they are no greater or less than any other words God inspired authors to record. It's a mind-set preferred by fluffy socially liberal Christians.

Regarding the site itself, I immediately react negatively upon seeing "Social Justice" given prominence. More and more, I am convinced that to a huge extent, "social" justice is the exact opposite of "actual" justice.

#2. I started off really disliking Trump. As someone else said, he's basically a Republican Obama. However, the irrational hatred on the left I've seen of him is making me reconsider my stance about him.

[KingsGambit]

2) Count me among those who doesn't have to pucker his sphincter, clench his teeth, and hold his nose regarding Trump. I don't freakin' care that he doesn't behave in a supposedly "Christ-like" way. In fact, I'm GLAD that he doesn't turn the other cheek or try to turn away wrath with a gentle answer. I'm justthisclose to thinking that a "proper" Christian can't be a good and effective POTUS.

I agree with your assessment that a true Christian can't do the job well. But if you are rejoicing in people disobeying the instructions of Jesus, then you need to reflect honestly on what role Christianity plays in your life and whether politics has become an idol for you.

[One Bad Pig]

I agree with your assessment that a true Christian can't do the job well. But if you are rejoicing in people disobeying the instructions of Jesus, then you need to reflect honestly on what role Christianity plays in your life and whether politics has become an idol for you.

I disagree that a true Christian cannot do the job well. I also disagree with your equation of "proper" and true. A "proper" Christian in the eyes of the world is one who doesn't take a stand for anything, but meekly lets others have their way. I agree witn NorrinRad, that person could not be an effective President. Jesus was not "proper". Yes, he turned the other cheek when personally threatened. However, when he saw people violating His Father's house, he decidedly did not.

[carpedm9587]

You say the kindest things....

Wow. Pot...Kettle...?

I think you have an over-active imagination.

Granted there is no proof, and it is possible it may not have happened. Given Trump's history and well documented narcissism, I'd give the scenario a reasonable probability, but I acknowledge it is speculation on my part. And I am still waiting for some follow-through from the PRK of the north. So far, not much that I can see.

I thought you didn't like 'whataboutism'.

Whataboutism is the practice of taking an accusation about X and diverting the conversation to Y without responding to the original accusation. It is done under the guise of "pointing out hypocrisy" even when no hypocrisy can be shown (i.e., when no one can show that the person making the accusation has been hypocritical). In this case, I am pointing to hypocrisy that is fairly well documented. I also raised the issue without an accompanying accusation, so it's not clear to me how my statement could even begin to be construed as "whataboutism."

Have another martini, carpe.

I did!

[carpedm9587]

Then nothing any of us say will satisfy you.

Not "nothing." But nothing so far has...

[carpedm9587]

I suspect I have rather similar feelings to MM regarding that post (which is why I gave in an 'amen'), and I'm not angry at oxmixmudd at all.

I found Oxmix's observation apt, and MM's response fairly typical (for him).

[NorrinRadd]

I agree with your assessment that a true Christian can't do the job well. But if you are rejoicing in people disobeying the instructions of Jesus, then you need to reflect honestly on what role Christianity plays in your life and whether politics has become an idol for you.

I like Trump being Trumpy. I like that he returns seven-fold. I like that he mocks. I like that he big-foots the UN.

I would be more polite and restrained, and I would therefore be a terrible POTUS, like Obama, Carter, etc.

[carpedm9587]

I like Trump being Trumpy. I like that he returns seven-fold. I like that he mocks. I like that he big-foots the UN.

I would be more polite and restrained, and I would therefore be a terrible POTUS, like Obama, Carter, etc.

That is a fairly common response from many evangelicals and many who call themselves Christian.

So much for "love your neighbor" and "bless those who persecute you" and "turn the other cheek."

Somehow, somewhere, the message attributed to Jesus became the message of a whimp. I find that interesting, since I have always thought is was the stronger man who lived his ethics and followed this type of "radical" teaching. It's what I have taught my children. The irony is...amazing...

[Sparko]

I admit I get angry at times. Is it a constant character trait? I certainly don't think so. Sarcasm. Now that might be a character trait of mine.

I think everyone gets angry at one time or another. Even Jesus did with the Pharisees (and Peter at least once)

I think a lot of atheists want Christians to be push-overs, like Flanders on the Simpsons, hey diddly-do neighbor! Turn the other cheek! Don't talk back!

It makes it so much easier to debate Christians if they just roll over and play dead, right?

[carpedm9587]

I admit I get angry at times. Is it a constant character trait? I certainly don't think so. Sarcasm. Now that might be a character trait of mine.

I think everyone gets angry at one time or another. Even Jesus did with the Pharisees (and Peter at least once)

I think a lot of atheists want Christians to be push-overs, like Flanders on the Simpsons, hey diddly-do neighbor! Turn the other cheek! Don't talk back!

It makes it so much easier to debate Christians if they just roll over and play dead, right?

I cannot speak for all atheists - just this one. "Turn the other cheek" has nothing to do with "being a pushover." A person can stand their ground without getting even or being vindictive. A person can hold to their principles without calling names or being unkind.

This "I love it that he gives as good as he gets" flies in the face of what Jesus taught. Yes, Jesus is reported to have gotten angry and expressed himself angrily. I don't recall an instance of Jesus "getting even." I don't recall an instance of Jesus "giving as good as he got." Indeed, he was reportedly a master at defusing "trap" questions. He primarily grew angry at hypocrisy - and I don't think there is any less hypocrisy on either side of the political spectrum.

[Cow Poke]

I cannot speak for all atheists - just this one. "Turn the other cheek" has nothing to do with "being a pushover." A person can stand their ground without getting even or being vindictive. A person can hold to their principles without calling names or being unkind.

This "I love it that he gives as good as he gets" flies in the face of what Jesus taught. Yes, Jesus is reported to have gotten angry and expressed himself angrily. I don't recall an instance of Jesus "getting even." I don't recall an instance of Jesus "giving as good as he got." Indeed, he was reportedly a master at defusing "trap" questions. He primarily grew angry at hypocrisy - and I don't think there is any less hypocrisy on either side of the political spectrum.

I think what gets lost in this is the fact that Jesus was pretty blunt and "not so kind" to those who were simply out to attack him - in His case - the scribes, pharisees, etc....

If I encounter somebody who's even REMOTELY interested in the Gospel, I'm happy to entertain them, and even put up with quite a bit of crap.

When it's internet s, however, who have absolutely no interest in having a discussion, but are simply here to attack -- I don't have a whole lot of patience for that.

[NorrinRadd]

That is a fairly common response from many evangelicals and many who call themselves Christian.

So much for "love your neighbor" and "bless those who persecute you" and "turn the other cheek."

Somehow, somewhere, the message attributed to Jesus became the message of a whimp. I find that interesting, since I have always thought is was the stronger man who lived his ethics and followed this type of "radical" teaching. It's what I have taught my children. The irony is...amazing...

As I said, I'm very close to believing a Christian can't be a good POTUS. I don't want a National Pastor. I want a POTUS who will behave in a way that is good for the country, and frankly, I think the necessary behavior would generally be considered "unchristlike."