Originally posted by Tassman
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If you think this is the area where you tell everyone you are sorry for eating their lunch out of the fridge, it probably isn't the place for you
This forum is open discussion between atheists and all theists to defend and debate their views on religion or non-religion. Please respect that this is a Christian-owned forum and refrain from gratuitous blasphemy. VERY wide leeway is given in range of expression and allowable behavior as compared to other areas of the forum, and moderation is not overly involved unless necessary. Please keep this in mind. Atheists who wish to interact with theists in a way that does not seek to undermine theistic faith may participate in the World Religions Department. Non-debate question and answers and mild and less confrontational discussions can take place in General Theistics.
Forum Rules: Here
This forum is open discussion between atheists and all theists to defend and debate their views on religion or non-religion. Please respect that this is a Christian-owned forum and refrain from gratuitous blasphemy. VERY wide leeway is given in range of expression and allowable behavior as compared to other areas of the forum, and moderation is not overly involved unless necessary. Please keep this in mind. Atheists who wish to interact with theists in a way that does not seek to undermine theistic faith may participate in the World Religions Department. Non-debate question and answers and mild and less confrontational discussions can take place in General Theistics.
Forum Rules: Here
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Originally posted by Tassman View PostThe long history of barbaric behaviour for which the Abrahamic religions have been responsible, has been on a par with the non-Abrahamic populous that surrounded them. IOW: the religion makes no difference for better or worse...which is my point. It's ineffective.
Vice versa more like it!
Next, you need to show that a person or people with religion is no different than the same people or person without that religion. Since that can only be speculation you can only convince those who find your speculations valuable. And since you are admittedly dishonest (seeing nothing wrong with plagiarism) and evidently have an axe to grind those who find your speculations convincing is going to be a small and gullible group.
Lastly, analyzing the impact of religions with thousands of years of history across very different peoples, circumstances and cultures is not at all a simple task, except for obviously shallow 'thinkers' like yourself....>>> Witty remark or snarky quote of another poster goes here <<<...
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That is right Tass, in spite of it. There is nothing inherent in the Christian faith that leads to colonial expansion, Inquisitions, religious wars, etc... Just the opposite. But men are wicked and will use and twist even the most sublime teachings in the quest for personal power and wealth. Of course in your world this is all perfectly natural - just animals doing what animals do...Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s
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Originally posted by MaxVel View PostYour objection can't even get off the ground, since you can't provide an objective moral standard to measure things against.The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.
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Originally posted by MaxVel View PostLastly, analyzing the impact of religions with thousands of years of history across very different peoples, circumstances and cultures is not at all a simple task, except for obviously shallow 'thinkers' like yourself.The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.
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Originally posted by Tassman View PostThe long history of barbaric behaviour for which the Abrahamic religions have been responsible, has been on a par with the non-Abrahamic populous that surrounded them. IOW: the religion makes no difference for better or worse...which is my point. It's ineffective.
Pol Pot: 1 - 3 million
Hitler: 15 - 20 million
Stalin: 20 - 25 million
Mao Zedong: 40 - 70 million
Total: 76 - 118 million people
Can you come up with a religious body count that is "on par" with roughly 100 million?
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We have only seen the rise of atheistic nations in the past hundred years and their track record to date is not very good. And that is an understatement.
I'm always still in trouble again
"You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
"Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
"Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman
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Originally posted by rogue06 View PostWe have only seen the rise of atheistic nations in the past hundred years and their track record to date is not very good. And that is an understatement.
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Originally posted by Tassman View PostThe track record of the more secular nations, e.g. in the Scandinavian countries, is very good...considerably better in many instances than overtly religious countries, including the USA.Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s
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Originally posted by element771 View PostIt is obviously.
A couple of things....
I think that the "new atheists" confirm the quote in some respects. They may be okay at science but their level of philosophical discourse is laughable.
The number of atheists in science, has remained steady for pretty much a century... not sure about philosophers.
But as scientific and philosophical competency increases, the proportion of atheists also increases to over 90 percent in the National Academy, and the remnant theists have highly nuanced views of divinity.
Nagel's a bit of a nut, with a history of supporting the redefinition of science far enough to include alchemy, astrology, and intelligent design. His honesty may not be suspect, but his views of science and scientists most certainly are. His fame, in Christian circles, is far out of proportion to his philosophical impact, something I've noted holds true for most Christian scientists and philosophers.
It's like theistic affirmative action or something.
Unless you're Francis Collins, in which case you're despised for supporting that evillusion stuff. Entirely by coincidence, I'm sure, the proportion of biologists who are atheists is higher than in any other field. It's not as if Christians were deliberately driving them out of their churches. Nah, that couldn't be it.
Nagel doesn't speak for any but the smallest fringe of scientists. He certainly doesn't speak for me.
I'll agree with him to this extent: I'd prefer, when trying to scrutinize the inscrutable, that there weren't any divine actors out there chortling with glee as they bump the chess table and make the game unplayable.
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