Representations and depictions of the deity

[Hypatia_Alexandria]

A blatant forgery when you consider...

I quite agree.

It appears that over the centuries there were some forty three “True Shrouds” of Christ in medieval Europe alone.

At the time of this shroud’s appearance the Bishop of Troyes was urged by his fellow churchmen to conduct a full inquiry, which he did, and according to his successor Bishop Pierre d’Arcis, afterwards reported that the shroud was a fraud and this had been attested by the artist who had painted it.

[Hypatia_Alexandria]

Pretty much, yeah.

For looks - not politics - Osama Bin Laden would also have provided a good example.

[tabibito]

A blatant forgery when you consider...

(1) The cloth covering Jesus's head was separate from the linen cloth covering the rest of His body.



(2) The earliest historical mention of the shroud's existence was in 1354, consistent with carbon dating of AD 1269 - 1390.

(3) Just my own personal observation, which I need to address tactfully: The figure is supposedly lying flat on his back with his arms by his side, but his arms are long enough so that the hands can modestly cover his genitals. I'm sure the crucifixion couldn't have stretched his arms by about another ten inches.

Not so hasty good sir.

The cloth of Oviedo (a face-cloth of the type that you mention) is being compared with the Shroud of Turin. The provenance for that cloth is somewhat more certain than that of the shroud, and there are some interesting comparisons. So far there are matches in key points - blood type particularly - AB, not exactly the most common of groups. As for the C14 tests on the shroud - it is unfortunate that, the shroud having been exposed to heat of fire, those tests might be rather unreliable.

And point 3 ... without viewing the relevant parts of the image to see what supports the argument, it seems strange that a perfectly ordinary anatomy would be unable to reproduce that circumstance.

We discussed the shroud on TWeb some years ago - nothing offered since has given me cause to modify the conclusions reached then - it can't be definitively declared a fake. Nor has anything changed my opinion of relics in the interim - I don't trust the reports, I don't like the concept.

ETA: https://www.catholicculture.org/cult...fm?recnum=3953

[Faber]

I like this depiction...

191211192030-turin-shroud-getty-restricted-full-169.jpg

A blatant forgery when you consider...

(1) The cloth covering Jesus's head was separate from the linen cloth covering the rest of His body.

Simon Peter arrived just after him. He entered the tomb and saw the linen cloths lying there. The cloth that had been around Jesus’ head was rolled up, lying separate from the linen cloths. (John 20:6-7)

(2) The earliest historical mention of the shroud's existence was in 1354, consistent with carbon dating of AD 1269 - 1390.

(3) Just my own personal observation, which I need to address tactfully: The figure is supposedly lying flat on his back with his arms by his side, but his arms are long enough so that the hands can modestly cover his genitals. I'm sure the crucifixion couldn't have stretched his arms by about another ten inches.

[seer]

I like this depiction...

191211192030-turin-shroud-getty-restricted-full-169.jpg

[rogue06]

Yeah, but that's not His typical earthly form. Seems like it may be a preview of His then-future glorified state, or as much of such as can be safely perceived by mortal eyes.

Point being it has precedence and wasn't something made up out of the blue.

[NorrinRadd]

There is biblical basis for the latter. For instance:

Scripture Verse: Mark 9:3

and his clothes became radiant, intensely white, as no one on earth could bleach them.

© Copyright Original Source

Scripture Verse: Luke 9:29

And as he was praying, the appearance of his face was altered, and his clothing became dazzling white

© Copyright Original Source

Yeah, but that's not His typical earthly form. Seems like it may be a preview of His then-future glorified state, or as much of such as can be safely perceived by mortal eyes.

[NorrinRadd]

More like this but with a longer beard?

Pretty much, yeah.

[rogue06]

Indeed given we have no idea what the man may have looked like. I have often thought Bin Laden could have made a good Jesus - albeit the wrong faith - but he was a Semite

I assume by "worship space" you are referring to churches and other religious buildings?

The depictions of course can lead to travesties - with Jesus having blonde hair that looks as if it has been professionally styled in some manner, blue eyes, and a spotless white robe.

There is biblical basis for the latter. For instance:

Scripture Verse: Mark 9:3

and his clothes became radiant, intensely white, as no one on earth could bleach them.

© Copyright Original Source

Scripture Verse: Luke 9:29

And as he was praying, the appearance of his face was altered, and his clothing became dazzling white

© Copyright Original Source

[tabibito]

The painting of Jesus knocking on the door...That was on my grandmothers wall as well. It was a genre that helped to create a comfortable home for many people of that generation.

The small statue that Tabibito posted...some may see that as sarcastic and irreverent. I would bet that the artist probably meant for it to be. But i'll bet that there are people in this world somewhere who would enshrine that figure.

Finally remembered the name of the movie - "Dogma." I'm fairly sure the statue was purpose crafted for the show.


ETA - Reading the label on the pic, seems I should have read it before I made the post.

[Hypatia_Alexandria]

I would have trouble with portraying misbehaving people as Jesus

Pontius Pilate might have had a different take on that!

, but the physical type does seem a good match.

Both were Semites.

What might be termed the chapel itself, not the associated structures. But then I have a preference for the "chapel" to be unadorned - not even a cross.

So nothing in the sacred space? I understand.

No problem with that from my point of view - nor with Asian or Black African, nor any indigenous group. Jesus' was ethnically Jewish, but no insult is offered in portraying him as a person that the locals can relate to.

That was demonstrated rather well by researchers from the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill in 2018.

[Hypatia_Alexandria]

The painting of Jesus knocking on the door...That was on my grandmothers wall as well. It was a genre that helped to create a comfortable home for many people of that generation.

I'd suggest this is a better version. At least Holman Hunt had some talent.

The small statue that Tabibito posted...some may see that as sarcastic and irreverent. I would bet that the artist probably meant for it to be. But i'll bet that there are people in this world somewhere who would enshrine that figure.

You can have it on the dash.

[tabibito]

Indeed given we have no idea what the man may have looked like. I have often thought Bin Laden could have made a good Jesus - albeit the wrong faith - but he was a Semite.

I would have trouble with portraying misbehaving people as Jesus, but the physical type does seem a good match.

I assume by "worship space" you are referring to churches and other religious buildings?

What might be termed the chapel itself, not the associated structures. But then I have a preference for the "chapel" to be unadorned - not even a cross. If the socialising areas have as much adornment as suits the congregation, I feel no discomfort. (can't speak for others.)

The depictions of course can lead to travesties - with Jesus having blonde hair that looks as if it has been professionally styled in some manner, blue eyes, and a spotless white robe.

No problem with that from my point of view - nor with Asian or Black African, nor any indigenous group. Jesus' was ethnically Jewish, but no insult is offered in portraying him as a person that the locals can relate to.

[Machinist]

The painting of Jesus knocking on the door...That was on my grandmothers wall as well. It was a genre that helped to create a comfortable home for many people of that generation.

The small statue that Tabibito posted...some may see that as sarcastic and irreverent. I would bet that the artist probably meant for it to be. But i'll bet that there are people in this world somewhere who would enshrine that figure.

[Hypatia_Alexandria]

I found that assertion somewhat amusing myself.

Indeed given we have no idea what the man may have looked like. I have often thought Bin Laden could have made a good Jesus - albeit the wrong faith - but he was a Semite

I have reservations about such depictions in "worship space." Elsewhere, there are ordinarily no problems.

I assume by "worship space" you are referring to churches and other religious buildings?

The depictions of course can lead to travesties - with Jesus having blonde hair that looks as if it has been professionally styled in some manner, blue eyes, and a spotless white robe.