The Saving results of the Death of Christ !

[Dave L]

Not all the Jews rejected Him. The good Jews accepted Him.

A few were born again or they could not believe in him. Faith is a fruit of the Holy Spirit.

[footwasher]

This is true of born again believers. But people love their sin and hate God apart from the new birth. If not true, why did the Jews reject the God they claimed to worship? He stood right in front of them.

Not all the Jews rejected Him. The good Jews accepted Him.

[Dave L]

The Bible says every man wants to do good, but his flesh resists his spirit:

Rom 7:21So this is the principle I have discovered: When I want to do good, evil is right there with me. 22For in my inner being I delight in God’s law. 23But I see another law at work in my body, warring against the law of my mind and holding me captive to the law of sin that dwells within me.

See, his inner being, his nobler side delights in God's law.

Who wouldn't want to do good always? To be saved from the nagging of a guilty conscience? If it's easy, everyone would prefer it. However, the flesh tells us it's too hard, so the flesh wins over the nobler side/spirit/inner being/mind.

This is true of born again believers. But people love their sin and hate God apart from the new birth. If not true, why did the Jews reject the God they claimed to worship? He stood right in front of them.

[footwasher]

But you cannot have a nobler side unless you are born again. Where do you find nobility in the flesh?

The Bible says every man wants to do good, but his flesh resists his spirit:

Rom 7:21So this is the principle I have discovered: When I want to do good, evil is right there with me. 22For in my inner being I delight in God’s law. 23But I see another law at work in my body, warring against the law of my mind and holding me captive to the law of sin that dwells within me.

See, his inner being, his nobler side delights in God's law.

Who wouldn't want to do good always? To be saved from the nagging of a guilty conscience? If it's easy, everyone would prefer it. However, the flesh tells us it's too hard, so the flesh wins over the nobler side/spirit/inner being/mind.

[Dave L]

This is addressed to brightflame52 not you.

I'm sorry to have upset you. But all things work together for good to those who love the Lord.

[footwasher]

I shared my conversion experience earlier. Unless you know the truth, you can be lying and not know you are. How do you know you are not lying?

This is addressed to brightflame52 not you.

[Dave L]

I repeat:

If we obey our nobler side, our spiritual side, we will bear fruit (Gal 5:22-25).

“But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law. And they that are Christ’s have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts. If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit.” Galatians 5:22–25 (KJV 1900)

They have crucified the flesh, they, not any external force, they are now living according to their spiritual side, so they are encouraged to also walk in it. Notice, they are not advised to wait for an external force to make them walk in it, it is their own motive power which is being appealed to.

Please show where I have gone wrong. Don't jump to other issues till you are done here.

But you cannot have a nobler side unless you are born again. Where do you find nobility in the flesh?

[Dave L]

Please explain your personal experiential conversion, how you changed from lying to not lying.

Don't jump to other issues till you are done here.

I shared my conversion experience earlier. Unless you know the truth, you can be lying and not know you are. How do you know you are not lying?

[footwasher]

Matthew 19:4; Mark 10:6; Luke 11:40; Hebrews 1:2; Acts 4:24; Acts 7:50; Acts 17:24; Revelation 14:7

The death of Christ results in a new creation !19

Please explain your personal experiential conversion, how you changed from lying to not lying.

Don't jump to other issues till you are done here.

[footwasher]

If you notice, nothing pertaining to Christ exists in the flesh. Only idol worship comes the closest. Faith on the other hand is a fruit of Having the Holy Spirit. Apples grow from trees as fruit. Faith grows from the Holy Spirit as fruit. You are suggesting wicked people save themselves while in the flesh which neither of these scriptures supports. How do you know you are saved?

I repeat:

If we obey our nobler side, our spiritual side, we will bear fruit (Gal 5:22-25).

“But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law. And they that are Christ’s have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts. If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit.” Galatians 5:22–25 (KJV 1900)

They have crucified the flesh, they, not any external force, they are now living according to their spiritual side, so they are encouraged to also walk in it. Notice, they are not advised to wait for an external force to make them walk in it, it is their own motive power which is being appealed to.

Please show where I have gone wrong. Don't jump to other issues till you are done here.

[Dave L]

I asked you to give Scriptural support for your views, which teach that men are totally depraved. You gave Gal 5:19-21.


But that does not say that men are incapable of God's command to hear and believe, the issue we are focused on. It only says the result of obeying our carnal nature, flesh, is sin. If we obey our nobler side, our spiritual side, we will bear fruit (Gal 5:22-25).

Believers crucify their flesh. Believers walk in their spirit. Choice is made.

Jesus is the author, the first cause, by feeding us bread from heaven, and finisher, by spreading a feast at the wedding banquet, the Cross. But we must buy oil for our lamps without money, wear wedding garments, or we will be like ground that drinks rain, not producing wheat and grain, but only produces thistles and thorns, Hebrews 6:4-8.


4For it is impossible, in the case of those who have once been enlightened and have tasted of the heavenly gift and have been made partakers of the Holy Spirit, 5and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, 6and then have [e]fallen away, to restore them again to repentance, [f]since they again crucify to themselves the Son of God and put Him to open shame. 7For ground that drinks the rain which often [g]falls on it and produces vegetation useful to those for whose sake it is also tilled, receives a blessing from God; 8but if it yields thorns and thistles, it is worthless and [h]close to being cursed, and [i]it ends up being burned.

Jesus gives us inspiration, edification through the Holy Spirit. He does not give us enablement to choose. We give us enablement to choose, by drinking rain and deciding to use that rain to produce grain and not thistle and thorns.

If you notice, nothing pertaining to Christ exists in the flesh. Only idol worship comes the closest. Faith on the other hand is a fruit of Having the Holy Spirit. Apples grow from trees as fruit. Faith grows from the Holy Spirit as fruit. You are suggesting wicked people save themselves while in the flesh which neither of these scriptures supports. How do you know you are saved?

[brightfame52]

Christs blood/Death converts them He died for, His Church or Sheep into a kingdom of priests Rev 1:5-6

5 And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood,

6 And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen. 18

Matthew 19:4; Mark 10:6; Luke 11:40; Hebrews 1:2; Acts 4:24; Acts 7:50; Acts 17:24; Revelation 14:7

The death of Christ results in a new creation !19

[footwasher]

When I showed Paul's works of the flesh in Galatians, you could not find a trace of anything that would lend itself towards salvation. Start with answering that. “Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.” Galatians 5:19–21 (KJV 1900)

Now, where is salvation found? “But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law. And they that are Christ’s have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts. If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit.” Galatians 5:22–25 (KJV 1900)

If Jesus is the author and finisher of our faith, where does the flesh fit in?

I asked you to give Scriptural support for your views, which teach that men are totally depraved. You gave Gal 5:19-21.


But that does not say that men are incapable of God's command to hear and believe, the issue we are focused on. It only says the result of obeying our carnal nature, flesh, is sin. If we obey our nobler side, our spiritual side, we will bear fruit (Gal 5:22-25).

Believers crucify their flesh. Believers walk in their spirit. Choice is made.

Jesus is the author, the first cause, by feeding us bread from heaven, and finisher, by spreading a feast at the wedding banquet, the Cross. But we must buy oil for our lamps without money, wear wedding garments, or we will be like ground that drinks rain, not producing wheat and grain, but only produces thistles and thorns, Hebrews 6:4-8.


4For it is impossible, in the case of those who have once been enlightened and have tasted of the heavenly gift and have been made partakers of the Holy Spirit, 5and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, 6and then have [e]fallen away, to restore them again to repentance, [f]since they again crucify to themselves the Son of God and put Him to open shame. 7For ground that drinks the rain which often [g]falls on it and produces vegetation useful to those for whose sake it is also tilled, receives a blessing from God; 8but if it yields thorns and thistles, it is worthless and [h]close to being cursed, and [i]it ends up being burned.

Jesus gives us inspiration, edification through the Holy Spirit. He does not give us enablement to choose. We give us enablement to choose, by drinking rain and deciding to use that rain to produce grain and not thistle and thorns.

[Dave L]

I do have Scriptural support, lots of them. But this has to be fair, I asked first. If you admit you have no support, I will still provide support for view.

Ball is in your court.

When I showed Paul's works of the flesh in Galatians, you could not find a trace of anything that would lend itself towards salvation. Start with answering that. “Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.” Galatians 5:19–21 (KJV 1900)

Now, where is salvation found? “But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law. And they that are Christ’s have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts. If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit.” Galatians 5:22–25 (KJV 1900)

If Jesus is the author and finisher of our faith, where does the flesh fit in?

[footwasher]

Why does God save people if they are able to save themselves? Do you have any scripture to support your view? Any examples?

I do have Scriptural support, lots of them. But this has to be fair, I asked first. If you admit you have no support, I will still provide support for view.

Ball is in your court.