Exploratory Thread: Tokyo Heroes

[Irate Canadian]

Okay, I'm not thinking I should play in this game. Basically, every time I try to look at the rules I get filled with disgust.

However this could just be my own mood and some bad memories cropping up. So, here is what it would take: Someone would need to convince me that despite the thrust of the system this can and will be a highly tactical campaign. Something where being "a band of hotblooded heroes" will lead to a Total Party Kill or at least massive civilian casualties. This is NOT saying that there can't be hot-blooded characters, nor indeed that they can't ALL be hotblooded... just as long as they are able to restrain themselves long enough for (at least some of us) to think through the situation before going in with not only a plan, but, quite frequently, at least one contingency plan.


It is more of a huge twist on "How did we get here anyway?".

Basically, one of the basic questions you have to ask in this genre if you are going to have depth to it is "So what do 6 guys in bullet-proof spandex have over 1,000 guys with assault rifles, grenades*, sniper rifles, helicopter-mounted rockets and chain guys, laser guided artillery, night-vision goggles ."
*Smoke, flashbang, fragmentation, perhaps white phosphorous.
**Yes, I know we are in an urban environment... it is called cutting the power to 6+ blocks, because you totally have the authority to call up the power company and make that happen.

Now, there are several ways to handle this. I hear that the actual Power-Rangers show used "bullets don't do much to monsters", but there also could be "teleportation is faster than choppers you rappel down from and you don't have the contacts or skills to learn how to use smoke grenades and such", "The monsters have the power to cloud people's minds such that no matter how many people they might end up killing they would still remain a myth in the eyes of the police and military"...

But what if lead bullets DID kill monsters? What if, in fact, all of us, on our very first outing, used our powers to raid a military base for assault rifles?

In fact, maybe we took them off the dead guards on a fly-speck of an island who got mind-whammyed into standing their until the moment their throats were ripped out. Our mentor might have directed us to do so since this was a nuclear missile base and the BBEG (not monster of the week, BBEG, in person, first mission) was going to magically/super-technologically hack the launch console and reduce the USA to 49 states plus some glow-in-the-dark real-estate in the middle of the Pacific. With the stakes so high, our mentor decided to have us break the rules without ever having told us what the rules were in the first place.

Alternatively, maybe we just looked at our chrome-and-plastic appearing weapons and said "Are you kidding me? This looks like a little kids toy! I'mma get me a REAL weapon.".

Anyway, BBEG lies dead at our feet. Game Over You Win!

Except... that wasn't the actual case. And the last thing our mentor wanted to do was to risk breaking the firey spirits that fuel our powers, because they will be needed again. The one thing you don't ask such heroes to do is sit around on their butts for 2 to 10 years for the chance to fix a problem that, from an emotional perspective, is kinda their own fault.

Did I mention that the oldest of us was probably 16 at the time?

Fast forward several years of goofing off with our powers, rescuing cats from trees, old ladies from burning buildings, and surprisingly little crimefighting...

Well it turns out that "only The Weapons of the Heart may truly slay these evils", BBEG is back, and not only bigger, stronger, and tougher, but SMARTER. Not in terms of gadgeteering ability to build death-rays, or IQ points (although maybe those too!), but, much more telling, in as much as he seems to have spent his little cosmic time-out reading at least "The Evil Overlord's List" if not "The Art of War" by Sun Tzu.

So, we are mature but firey, recklessness has given way to the 'acting in spite of your fears' of true bravery, our closest friends and family probably know of our powers.

Some of us may even have young children...

---

---

So... use as much or as little of that as you like, regardless of if I personally end up playing.

Eh, that sounds good for the next campaign... right now, I'm just going to go with what we have. It's up to you if you want to play or not. The Dark and Gritty version sounds like a good campaign to run when I am a more experienced GM.

[Irate Canadian]

BTW, what tactical systems do you like?

[Spartacus]

I expect this to be a fairly simple game run by a novice GM. All the things you say sound... interesting, but I'd rather deal with inside jokes than internal conflicts, and I prefer camp to carnage.

[Draco Dei]

Eh, that sounds good for the next campaign... right now, I'm just going to go with what we have. It's up to you if you want to play or not.

Let's go with "not" then.

Do want to clear up a few misconceptions though...

The Dark and Gritty version sounds like a good campaign to run when I am a more experienced GM.

There is nothing necessarily "Dark" about what I've described, and "Gritty" would only be in terms of "nitty-gritty details, because 'for want of a nail, a shoe was lost, for want of a shoe...".

BTW, what tactical systems do you like?

Haven't actually played that many systems but...
In practice: Most D&D/d20 I guess? Mutants and Masterminds proved barely tolerable from that perspective. I mostly do 3.5 D&D, but wouldn't be adverse to spreading out from that. 4E is the exception. I can't stand it. 5E is probably fine at the end of the day, but my prior experiences with it and its vague similarities to 4E give me the willies.
In theory, two things help:
1.) Narrative convention has little to no mechanical force, or if it does, it encourages precise and creative application rather than reducing things to their simplest components no matter how nuanced the description of the application is. In other words, a dramatically described action should not be inherently superior or even equal to a well thought out one. I wouldn't mind if BOTH were rewarded of course...
2.) A rulebook that is hundreds of pages long, and encourages writing up MORE. More simple systems such as D&D 5E can work almost as well as the more in-depth 3.5 style stuff, but I do like the ability to expand beyond mundane tools to having a wide variety of niche magical items. Naturally, this isn't required in Sci-Fi or modern settings. I like to create my own equipment*, rather than be limited to what is in the book. Similarly for spells and such.
*Have I mentioned I have a degree in Mechanical Engineering?

A system where the same plan of action for a given character works regardless of the opposition or your allies capabilities is a bad one (which means one must keep a lid on any munchkin tendencies in D&D 3.X, especially during character creation). Being able to easily scope out your opponents is also bad, although being able to do so with thought and caution is good. In other words give me planting bugs and sneaking around to scout over a simple scrying that comes down to a roll (and can be spammed) any day.

...I hope all that serves as a starting place? I feel like I'm not explaining this very well at all...

I expect this to be a fairly simple game run by a novice GM. All the things you say sound... interesting, but I'd rather deal with inside jokes than internal conflicts, and I prefer camp to carnage.

I understand, but I want to clarify that I wasn't thinking that there would necessarily be any big internal conflicts. BBEG is back, mentor was perfectly justified in not telling us he would be back, because that WOULD have resulted in internal conflicts, which would have played hob with our powers. Now though? With the war laying before us and the first battle mere days away, if we didn't already get ambushed in an attempt at taking out one or two of us with the first stroke?

"For such a time as this was I placed upon this Earth." (paraphrasing Ester)

"Target identified, commencing strategic analysis of assets, liabilities, probable avenues of attack, relevant defensive strong-points, likely ways to feed misinformation to foe via press conferences without endangering reputation with public, how to disguise our powers to give the impression of false weaknesses and strengths...

So he's gotten smart... I haven't been exactly sitting around on my butt either. I play 3-D chess blindfolded and have the locations of key points of the islands memorized from my work with emergency services. I have contingency plans for everything from volcanic eruption, naval invasion by the Chinese, hundreds of types of terrorist attacks, and six archetypical epidemic outbreak scenarios.

GAME ON!"

[Scorching Wizard]

Someone would need to convince me that despite the thrust of the system this can and will be a highly tactical campaign. Something where being "a band of hotblooded heroes" will lead to a Total Party Kill or at least massive civilian casualties. This is NOT saying that there can't be hot-blooded characters, nor indeed that they can't ALL be hotblooded... just as long as they are able to restrain themselves long enough for (at least some of us) to think through the situation before going in with not only a plan, but, quite frequently, at least one contingency plan.

The big problem with this, is that a highly tactical game requires the persons playing the characters to actually come up with the ideas. Most of us are not personally trained in warfare and tactics. It is our CHARACTERS that are. Thus while I personally can't come up with a specific tactical plan with three contingencies, my character can with a statement of objectives to the DM and a d20 roll.

[Teallaura]

I go a little both ways. There are times I want to use detail in role playing and have no problem with thinking out the overall strategy and detailed tactics. But sometimes you just want Superman to pick up the building and be done about it, physics be darned. After all, we aren't in a real world scenario to begin with, even when we emulate the real world.

For this world, I'd rather not do the 'how many rounds do you have left and who is point?" kind of thing. We're Power Rangers - we do slapstick karate and silly poses before fighting even dumber villains. Someone has to keep the world safe from Rita Replusa and let's face it, Sgt. Rock would end up taking out half a town just dealing with one of her lower class henchmen.

[Teallaura]

Let's go with "not" then.

Do want to clear up a few misconceptions though...

There is nothing necessarily "Dark" about what I've described, and "Gritty" would only be in terms of "nitty-gritty details, because 'for want of a nail, a shoe was lost, for want of a shoe...".

Haven't actually played that many systems but...
In practice: Most D&D/d20 I guess? Mutants and Masterminds proved barely tolerable from that perspective. I mostly do 3.5 D&D, but wouldn't be adverse to spreading out from that. 4E is the exception. I can't stand it. 5E is probably fine at the end of the day, but my prior experiences with it and its vague similarities to 4E give me the willies.
In theory, two things help:
1.) Narrative convention has little to no mechanical force, or if it does, it encourages precise and creative application rather than reducing things to their simplest components no matter how nuanced the description of the application is. In other words, a dramatically described action should not be inherently superior or even equal to a well thought out one. I wouldn't mind if BOTH were rewarded of course...
2.) A rulebook that is hundreds of pages long, and encourages writing up MORE. More simple systems such as D&D 5E can work almost as well as the more in-depth 3.5 style stuff, but I do like the ability to expand beyond mundane tools to having a wide variety of niche magical items. Naturally, this isn't required in Sci-Fi or modern settings. I like to create my own equipment*, rather than be limited to what is in the book. Similarly for spells and such.
*Have I mentioned I have a degree in Mechanical Engineering?

A system where the same plan of action for a given character works regardless of the opposition or your allies capabilities is a bad one (which means one must keep a lid on any munchkin tendencies in D&D 3.X, especially during character creation). Being able to easily scope out your opponents is also bad, although being able to do so with thought and caution is good. In other words give me planting bugs and sneaking around to scout over a simple scrying that comes down to a roll (and can be spammed) any day.

...I hope all that serves as a starting place? I feel like I'm not explaining this very well at all...


I understand, but I want to clarify that I wasn't thinking that there would necessarily be any big internal conflicts. BBEG is back, mentor was perfectly justified in not telling us he would be back, because that WOULD have resulted in internal conflicts, which would have played hob with our powers. Now though? With the war laying before us and the first battle mere days away, if we didn't already get ambushed in an attempt at taking out one or two of us with the first stroke?

"For such a time as this was I placed upon this Earth." (paraphrasing Ester)

"Target identified, commencing strategic analysis of assets, liabilities, probable avenues of attack, relevant defensive strong-points, likely ways to feed misinformation to foe via press conferences without endangering reputation with public, how to disguise our powers to give the impression of false weaknesses and strengths...

So he's gotten smart... I haven't been exactly sitting around on my butt either. I play 3-D chess blindfolded and have the locations of key points of the islands memorized from my work with emergency services. I have contingency plans for everything from volcanic eruption, naval invasion by the Chinese, hundreds of types of terrorist attacks, and six archetypical epidemic outbreak scenarios.

GAME ON!"

There's a middle ground - I get that.

[Spartacus]

I go a little both ways. There are times I want to use detail in role playing and have no problem with thinking out the overall strategy and detailed tactics. But sometimes you just want Superman to pick up the building and be done about it, physics be darned. After all, we aren't in a real world scenario to begin with, even when we emulate the real world.

For this world, I'd rather not do the 'how many rounds do you have left and who is point?" kind of thing. We're Power Rangers - we do slapstick karate and silly poses before fighting even dumber villains. Someone has to keep the world safe from Rita Replusa and let's face it, Sgt. Rock would end up taking out half a town just dealing with one of her lower class henchmen.

Yeah, we only take out half the town when we have to use our giant mecha to fight mid-level minions that have super-sized themselves.

[Teallaura]

Yeah, we only take out half the town when we have to use our giant mecha to fight mid-level minions that have super-sized themselves.

No, silly. Our giant mecha only gets thrown once into an abandoned building outside of the town that was to be torn down anyway.

We even unwittingly save the comic relief antagonists in the process.

[Irate Canadian]

Once I get character sheets from JP and SW, we can start the game!

[JardinPrayer]

Tribal Yellow reporting for duty, albeit with trepidation. Gimme a sec...I'll take a stab at my first character sheet in the next post. It won't be complete, cuz I'm still understanding the team stuff.

[Irate Canadian]

Tribal Yellow reporting for duty, albeit with trepidation. Gimme a sec...I'll take a stab at my first character sheet in the next post. It won't be complete, cuz I'm still understanding the team stuff.

yay!

[JardinPrayer]

Name: Silvia Suzhou
Concept: Earth Mother with vast knowledge of plants and a strong desire to heal and protect the good.
Gender: Female
Aspect: Tribal Yellow
Keys: Cause (heal & protect good); Specialty (master herbalist, hypnotist & archer)

Fault: Blindness. Difficulty seeing the big picture, laser-focused on the task at hand; vulnerable to attack because she doesn't perceive it when pursuing her cause.

Attributes:

Attack: 4
Defense: 2
Athletics: 2
Brains: 3
Spirit: 4

Secondary Values:

Initative: 9
Resistance: 10
Stamina: 26

Edges:

TEAM:

Basic Attack: Herbal Potion-Tipped Arrows
Special Attack: Hypnosis (Post-Hypnotic Suggestion)
Vehicle Defender
Group Asset: Finishing Attack
Group Asset: Robot.

PERSONAL:
Knack (hypnotism, archery, herbal potions)
Property (underground cave system hidden deep in the forest)
Profession (Herbal Medic)


Profile:

Silvia has always lived in the forest as a loner. Her most trusted companions are plants. She considers them allies and friends. She lives in a fast network of underground caves hidden deep in the forest, where she has an herbal lab. She keeps her long, grey hair in a large bun at the top of her head, fastened with a special clasp which serves as a transmitter for her hypotic thought waves. She wears a simple natural fiber dress with a vine belt and her quiver of arrows strapped to her back. Deeply-ingrained in her character is a desire to heal and protect any living thing she perceives as "good." This means unhesitatingly doing away with any threat to that process. Her herb-tipped arrows carry potions which can paralyze, confuse, knock-out any threat. She never...ever...misses her target. Silvia doesn't work well in a group, but the greater mission has invoked her sense of cause. So, she has opened her cave network to the Rangers and relies on them to cover her as she does what she does best.

[Irate Canadian]

Name: Silvia Suzhou
Concept: Earth Mother with vast knowledge of plants and a strong desire to heal and protect the good.
Gender: Female
Aspect: Tribal Yellow
Keys: Cause (heal & protect good); Specialty (master herbalist, hypnotist & archer)

Fault: Blindness. Difficulty seeing the big picture, laser-focused on the task at hand; vulnerable to attack because she doesn't perceive it when pursuing her cause.

Attributes:

Attack: 4
Defense: 2
Athletics: 2
Brains: 3
Spirit: 4

Secondary Values:

Initative: 9
Resistance: 10
Stamina: 26

Edges:

TEAM:

Basic Attack
Special Attack
Vehicle Defender
Group Asset: Finishing Attack
Group Asset: Robot.

PERSONAL:
Knack (hypnotism, archery, herbal potions)
Property (underground cave system hidden deep in the forest)
Profession (Herbal Medic)


Profile:

Looks pretty good so far.. but let me make sure you've not left anything off.

[JardinPrayer]

How did I do? Do I get the basic concept?