Originally posted by Starlight
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Originally posted by Leonhard View PostThere's a difference between losing a priviledged position, and that of losing freedom. Namely the freedom to raise your children the way you want.
For that reason, would you support laws against home education, or must everything be pre-approved by the state?
Is that all you're arguing for? One hour of material?
However, its interesting that you wouldn't even allow a parent the freedom to have their children opt out of that one hour."I hate him passionately", he's "a demonic force" - Tucker Carlson, in private, on Donald Trump
"Every line of serious work that I have written since 1936 has been written, directly or indirectly, against totalitarianism and for democratic socialism" - George Orwell
"[Capitalism] as it exists today is, in my opinion, the real source of evils. I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy" - Albert Einstein
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What about the freedom of the children to access knowledge and to make informed choices?
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Originally posted by Starlight View PostI sometimes see US commentators express the idea that parents have some sort of fundamental and undeniable right to raise their children in any way they see fit, up to and including the idea that parents can essentially go to extreme lengths to make sure their children believe exactly the same thing as their parents.
I think most people in my country would agree with my view on this,
I have no idea where typical Danish opinion lies on that spectrum.
Only the worst kind of nationalists are arguing that muslim immigrants have to be forced to have sex education in order to slowly assimilate and danify them.
(I should add perhaps, that homeschooling is currently legal here, and there is no significant political debate on that issue currently, however I suspect that it will be banned in the long-term as an increasing number of people see it as being used primarily for extremists to indoctrinate their children)
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Originally posted by Leonhard View PostDo you live in Britain? Just guessing here.
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Originally posted by Leonhard View PostWhat freedom? You mean the children would have the freedom to opt out of those classes, if they didn't want them?
The situation I was talking about was if the parents try to prevent the child ever making certain choices by depriving the child of the knowledge that would have been necessary to make those choices, then the parents have intentionally removed freedoms (that choices) from the child. The parents thus force the child to make the 'right' decisions by depriving them of the freedom to make those decisions through depriving them of knowledge necessary to even know those choices exist in the first place. Any time a parent does this sort of thing it's inherently the parents using their freedoms to strip freedoms from the child. I feel that limits ought to exist on the parents' ability to strip freedoms from their children and make life choices for their children.
Parents should be sharing their values with children and explaining why their own values differ to the values of 'the world' (if they do), and offering reasons why the child ought to adhere to the parents' moral code rather than the world's. But they should not be trying to shape the values of their children in a coercive manner that seeks to deliberately hide knowledge of 'the world' from the children in order to try and force the child to follow the parents' view by preventing them ever hearing or knowing any alternate views. When parents start expressing fears about what things their kids might be learning at school, then I start to get angry, because it indicates the presence of a coercive and manipulative home environment that seeks to control children and strip them of their own free choice and their own knowledge of the world."I hate him passionately", he's "a demonic force" - Tucker Carlson, in private, on Donald Trump
"Every line of serious work that I have written since 1936 has been written, directly or indirectly, against totalitarianism and for democratic socialism" - George Orwell
"[Capitalism] as it exists today is, in my opinion, the real source of evils. I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy" - Albert Einstein
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Originally posted by Starlight View PostThe situation I was talking about was if the parents try to prevent the child ever making certain choices by depriving the child of the knowledge that would have been necessary to make those choices, then the parents have intentionally removed freedoms (that choices) from the child. The parents thus force the child to make the 'right' decisions by depriving them of the freedom to make those decisions through depriving them of knowledge necessary to even know those choices exist in the first place. Any time a parent does this sort of thing it's inherently the parents using their freedoms to strip freedoms from the child. I feel that limits ought to exist on the parents' ability to strip freedoms from their children and make life choices for their children.The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.
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Originally posted by Leonhard View PostThe communists did that, and it wasn't a pretty sight.
Do you live in Britain? Just guessing here.
Only the worst kind of nationalists are arguing that muslim immigrants have to be forced to have sex education in order to slowly assimilate and danify them.
Now that sounds like Britain."I hate him passionately", he's "a demonic force" - Tucker Carlson, in private, on Donald Trump
"Every line of serious work that I have written since 1936 has been written, directly or indirectly, against totalitarianism and for democratic socialism" - George Orwell
"[Capitalism] as it exists today is, in my opinion, the real source of evils. I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy" - Albert Einstein
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Originally posted by Starlight View Post
Yes, I would advocate the banning of homeschooling, except in cases of disability. (See the addendum to my previous post that I added in a later edit)"It's evolution; every time you invent something fool-proof, the world invents a better fool."
-Unknown
"Preach the gospel, and if necessary use words." - Most likely St.Francis
I find that evolution is the best proof of God.
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I support the :
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Originally posted by Starlight View PostYeah, well we are. We are a British colony, and are much more like Britain than the US is.The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.
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Originally posted by Cow Poke View PostSo, for example, a child has an interest in guns, and the parents don't allow guns in the house, or the child to have books or magazines about guns, or to touch guns..... you would counsel those parents to stop removing choices from the child?"I hate him passionately", he's "a demonic force" - Tucker Carlson, in private, on Donald Trump
"Every line of serious work that I have written since 1936 has been written, directly or indirectly, against totalitarianism and for democratic socialism" - George Orwell
"[Capitalism] as it exists today is, in my opinion, the real source of evils. I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy" - Albert Einstein
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Originally posted by Starlight View PostA ban on the child actually having a gun might be reasonably warranted due to concerns about safety, depending on the age of the child. A ban on books or magazines about guns...?! That's getting into the draconian territory I'm concerned about. Any time you're banning knowledge about the world from a child, when the child would have wanted to have that knowledge, then I have a problem with it. If a child wants to learn something about the world then they should be able to learn it. Fortunately the internet largely means that such knowledge-denying parenting is a thing of the past.The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.
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Originally posted by Starlight View PostSeriously? You're going to play the communism card?
New Zealand.
Hmm, okay, different priorities. No one here would even consider that as a possible reason. The concern for everyone would be the well-being of the children, and how that balanced against the wishes of their parents.
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Originally posted by Cow Poke View PostCause we decided to no longer be a British colony."I hate him passionately", he's "a demonic force" - Tucker Carlson, in private, on Donald Trump
"Every line of serious work that I have written since 1936 has been written, directly or indirectly, against totalitarianism and for democratic socialism" - George Orwell
"[Capitalism] as it exists today is, in my opinion, the real source of evils. I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy" - Albert Einstein
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