Originally posted by oxmixmudd
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Ahmaud Arbery; racist killing and attempted cover up.
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That's what
- She
Without a clear-cut definition of sin, morality becomes a mere argument over the best way to train animals
- Manya the Holy Szin (The Quintara Marathon)
I may not be as old as dirt, but me and dirt are starting to have an awful lot in common
- Stephen R. Donaldson
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Originally posted by Charles View PostYou are not disagreeing with me but yourself on this one. You have claimed you are not accusing the victim and that you are not trying to justify the actions taken against him. Yet it is rather obvious that you are trying to accuse him (or to claim things making him look bad are "facts") and when pressed you simply point out (contrary to what you have said earlier) that it is important in order to evaluate the actions taken against him (with regards to these you are much more reluctant to establish any facts). So, it seems you want to have it both ways. I think this is what Ox saw at a very early point, and you are simply fooling yourself if you refuse to see it.
And for JimL to keep harping on Zimmerman, who was found not guilty in a court of law, shows just how little respect he has for the law and our justice system's rules.That's what
- She
Without a clear-cut definition of sin, morality becomes a mere argument over the best way to train animals
- Manya the Holy Szin (The Quintara Marathon)
I may not be as old as dirt, but me and dirt are starting to have an awful lot in common
- Stephen R. Donaldson
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Originally posted by Bill the Cat View PostSorry Chuck, but no he isn't. The relevant facts of the case include the motive for attempting to detain him. As stated, the local police were using the dad as a local resource, which isn't unprecedented, especially in rural counties. That some of the relevant facts "make Arbery look bad" is inconsequential to their value as facts.
And for JimL to keep harping on Zimmerman, who was found not guilty in a court of law, shows just how little respect he has for the law and our justice system's rules.
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Originally posted by Chuckles View PostYou have claimed you are not accusing the victim and that you are not trying to justify the actions taken against him.Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
Than a fool in the eyes of God
From "Fools Gold" by Petra
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Originally posted by Mountain Man View PostI'm not, but neither am I saying that their actions weren't justified. I'm not embracing either conclusion because we still don't have all the facts. This case can easily go either way, and I'm willing to keep an open mind. Are you?
Yet it is rather obvious that you are trying to accuse him (or to claim things making him look bad are "facts") and when pressed you simply point out (contrary to what you have said earlier) that it is important in order to evaluate the actions taken against him (with regards to these you are much more reluctant to establish any facts). So, it seems you want to have it both ways. I think this is what Ox saw at a very early point, and you are simply fooling yourself if you refuse to see it.
Try again.
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Originally posted by Mountain Man View PostI'm not, but neither am I saying that their actions weren't justified. I'm not embracing either conclusion because we still don't have all the facts. This case can easily go either way, and I'm willing to keep an open mind. Are you?
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Originally posted by Chuckles View PostTry again.
I'm not saying the actions of either party were justified or unjustified because we still don't have all the facts. This case can easily go either way, and I'm willing to keep an open mind. Are you?Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
Than a fool in the eyes of God
From "Fools Gold" by Petra
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Originally posted by JimLamebrain View PostIt is illegal for an armed posse to form and go after a suspect.Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
Than a fool in the eyes of God
From "Fools Gold" by Petra
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Originally posted by Mountain Man View PostOkay, let's try this again:
I'm not saying the actions of either party were justified or unjustified because we still don't have all the facts. This case can easily go either way, and I'm willing to keep an open mind. Are you?
Yet it is rather obvious that you are trying to accuse him (or to claim things making him look bad are "facts") and when pressed you simply point out (contrary to what you have said earlier) that it is important in order to evaluate the actions taken against him (with regards to these you are much more reluctant to establish any facts). So, it seems you want to have it both ways. I think this is what Ox saw at a very early point, and you are simply fooling yourself if you refuse to see it.
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Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post[...]
I'm not saying the actions of either party were justified or unjustified because we still don't have all the facts.
Originally posted by Mountain Man View PostFirst of all, entering a property under construction is trespassing.
Secondly, this guy wasn't out jogging, and he didn't just happen to wander by and poke his head in out of curiosity. The neighborhood in question was ten-miles from his home, and he had cased the place at night on multiple occasions. Furthermore, let's not pretend that construction sites aren't a popular target for thieves.
Third, he was shot as a direct result of his own aggressive actions. If he had quietly waited for the police to arrive then he would still be alive.
I'm not saying he deserved to be shot, or that the guys were necessarily right to approach him while armed, or any nonsense like, but this lie that he was just some innocent black man out for a jog needs to be rejected. Come on, ox, I thought you were a defender of the truth.
This certainly puts another of your statements into perspective:
Originally posted by Mountain Man View PostThis case can easily go either way, and I'm willing to keep an open mind. Are you?
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Originally posted by Chuckles View PostSo, let's see if you insist none of the actions described by yourself below are to be regarded as unjustified:
It is interesting to see how you, once again, contradict statements made such a short time ago.
This certainly puts another of your statements into perspective:
Contradicting one self is not being open minded, Mountain Man.Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
Than a fool in the eyes of God
From "Fools Gold" by Petra
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Originally posted by oxmixmudd View PostNo - that is not a lie. I said "it is your bias that keeps you from realizing ...". Do you understand what that means MM? I means that you don't understand that is what you are doing. And I then go on to explain why. What it is about your bias that is blinding you to the fact you are, in fact, providing justification for (i.e justifying) these guys.
So, my logic could be flawed that leads me to conclude you are unknowingly justifying this situation, but there is no 'lie' involved here. I am not saying something about you I know to be untrue. I am saying you don't understand the implications of your words.Geislerminian Antinomian Kenotic Charispneumaticostal Gender Mutualist-Egalitarian.
Beige Federalist.
Nationalist Christian.
"Everybody is somebody's heretic."
Social Justice is usually the opposite of actual justice.
Proud member of the this space left blank community.
Would-be Grand Vizier of the Padishah Maxi-Super-Ultra-Hyper-Mega-MAGA King Trumpius Rex.
Justice for Ashli Babbitt!
Justice for Matthew Perna!
Arrest Ray Epps and his Fed bosses!
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Originally posted by Bill the Cat View PostRedneck is a racist and derogatory term. How very progressive of you...Geislerminian Antinomian Kenotic Charispneumaticostal Gender Mutualist-Egalitarian.
Beige Federalist.
Nationalist Christian.
"Everybody is somebody's heretic."
Social Justice is usually the opposite of actual justice.
Proud member of the this space left blank community.
Would-be Grand Vizier of the Padishah Maxi-Super-Ultra-Hyper-Mega-MAGA King Trumpius Rex.
Justice for Ashli Babbitt!
Justice for Matthew Perna!
Arrest Ray Epps and his Fed bosses!
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