Coronavirus Outbreak...

[Mountain Man]

It is COVID-19. At present there is not a significant infection of any thing called 'Chinese flu' so far this year in the world. No scientist reports any form of Chinese flu' in the world today, maybe in a few months.

It is more than apparent your in extreme denial for the world pandemic of COVID-19.

I'm asking a simple question, one that you are apparently unable to answer.

[JimL]

I'm asking a simple question, one that you are apparently unable to answer.

That's because your question is misguided. If someone, and millions do, has a pre-existing condition which is excacerbated by coronavirus and so end up dying, they still died because of the coronavirus. They may have otherwise lived another 10, 20 or 30 years with their pre-existing conditions had they not been infected. Some people have stronger immune systems than others, but if they get infected and die we don't say, even though it be a factor, that the cause of their death was a weak immune system, we say they died from the virus.

[shunyadragon]

I'm asking a simple question, one that you are apparently unable to answer.

Answered the question a number of times. If you put your head back on and not leave it rolling around maybe you can make an intelligent response.

[shunyadragon]

That's because your question is misguided. If someone, and millions do, has a pre-existing condition which is excacerbated by coronavirus and so end up dying, they still died because of the coronavirus. They may have otherwise lived another 10, 20 or 30 years with their pre-existing conditions had they not been infected. Some people have stronger immune systems than others, but if they get infected and die we don't say, even though it be a factor, that the cause of their death was a weak immune system, we say they died from the virus.

Actually Mole Man is making a foolish attempt at not answering the questions intelligently, by calling COVID-19 the 'Chinese flu.' He probably takes the view that all the fatalities in the USA and the world are caused by China. Another Qanon conspiracy.

[Mountain Man]

Actually Mole Man is making a foolish attempt at not answering the questions intelligently, by calling COVID-19 the 'Chinese flu.' He probably takes the view that all the fatalities in the USA and the world are caused by China. Another Qanon conspiracy.

You may be studiously disinterested in the answer; however...

The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) website disclosed the shockingly small number of people who died from only the Wuhan coronavirus, with no other cause of death mentioned. Hold on to your hat because here it is: out of the 161,392 deaths in the CDC data, just six percent, about 9,700 deaths, were attributed to the coronavirus alone. According to the CDC, the other 94 percent had an average of 2.6 additional conditions or causes of deaths, such as heart disease, diabetes, and sepsis.

https://townhall.com/tipsheet/bronso...virus-n2575306

Then there's this from the New York Times:

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/08/29/h...s-testing.html

[seanD]

Quote me properly. I never made such a case. In fact I have posted that China, Russia, and Brazil under reported fatalities. Even with 200% under reporting the USA ihas the highest fatality rates in the world.

You implied it...

Another day of over a 1,000 fatalities for both the USA and Brazil. The highest fatality rate due to COVID-19 in the world.

And to think the US us under-reporting is kind of ridiculous when there are instances of fatalities being categorized as "covid fatalities" if the the individual tested positive even if that wasn't the direct cause of death.

[Stoic]

You may be studiously disinterested in the answer; however...

The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) website disclosed the shockingly small number of people who died from only the Wuhan coronavirus, with no other cause of death mentioned. Hold on to your hat because here it is: out of the 161,392 deaths in the CDC data, just six percent, about 9,700 deaths, were attributed to the coronavirus alone. According to the CDC, the other 94 percent had an average of 2.6 additional conditions or causes of deaths, such as heart disease, diabetes, and sepsis.

https://townhall.com/tipsheet/bronso...virus-n2575306

So about 9700 Americans who were otherwise perfectly healthy have died of covid-19, in less than 6 months.

That's probably worth keeping in mind.

[JimL]

You may be studiously disinterested in the answer; however...

The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) website disclosed the shockingly small number of people who died from only the Wuhan coronavirus, with no other cause of death mentioned. Hold on to your hat because here it is: out of the 161,392 deaths in the CDC data, just six percent, about 9,700 deaths, were attributed to the coronavirus alone. According to the CDC, the other 94 percent had an average of 2.6 additional conditions or causes of deaths, such as heart disease, diabetes, and sepsis.

https://townhall.com/tipsheet/bronso...virus-n2575306

Then there's this from the New York Times:

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/08/29/h...s-testing.html

That doesn't mean that the direct cause of their deaths was not coronavirus, it just means that, like millions of Americans they have pre-existing conditions that make them more vulnerable to succumbing to the disease.

[Mountain Man]

So about 9700 Americans who were otherwise perfectly healthy have died of covid-19, in less than 6 months.

There's nothing to suggest that the people "were otherwise perfectly healthy". That's simply the number of deaths attributed to the China flu alone. That doesn't mean other underlying causes were necessarily non-existent, only that they weren't reported.

[Stoic]

And to think the US us under-reporting is kind of ridiculous when there are instances of fatalities being categorized as "covid fatalities" if the the individual tested positive even if that wasn't the direct cause of death.

Not when there are lots of people who died who without ever making it to a hospital, and plenty of people who died in a hospital were not reported as covid-19 deaths because there wasn't enough test capacity to have them tested.

[Stoic]

There's nothing to suggest that the people "were otherwise perfectly healthy". That's simply the number of deaths attributed to the China flu alone. That doesn't mean other underlying causes were necessarily non-existent, only that they weren't reported.

It means that "as far as we know" they were otherwise perfectly healthy.

I wonder how many people the flu kills every year who had no known underlying conditions. I'll bet it's not nearly that many.

[Mountain Man]

It means that "as far as we know" they were otherwise perfectly healthy.

Exactly. Like I said, that doesn't mean other underlying causes were necessarily non-existent, only that they weren't reported. And this isn't even taking into account the number of China flu deaths that have been reported without confirming if the decedent actually had the virus.

The take away from the stories I referenced are: 1) the China flu is likely significantly less deadly than has been widely reported; and 2) the China flu is likely significantly less contagious than has been widely reported.

[seanD]

Not when there are lots of people who died who without ever making it to a hospital, and plenty of people who died in a hospital were not reported as covid-19 deaths because there wasn't enough test capacity to have them tested.

Can you prove this? Didn't think so. I highly doubt covid fatalities went unreported, but nether of us can prove that one way or another. What we can prove is that not only are there cases of fatalities listed as covid deaths when that wasn't the direct cause, but that there were even issues of false positives from the testing, which adds even more weight to the possibility of over-reporting, not under -reporting.

[Stoic]

Exactly. Like I said, that doesn't mean other underlying causes were necessarily non-existent, only that they weren't reported. And this isn't even taking into account the number of China flu deaths that have been reported without confirming if the decedent actually had the virus.

It also doesn't take into account the number of covid-19 deaths that were not reported due to difficulty in confirming that the decedent actually had the virus.

The take away from the stories I referenced are: 1) the China flu is likely significantly less deadly than has been widely reported; and 2) the China flu is likely significantly less contagious than has been widely reported.

Covid-19 is deadly enough that we need to get it under control, and contagious enough that that's going to take some concerted effort.

[Stoic]

Can you prove this? Didn't think so. I highly doubt covid fatalities went unreported, but nether of us can prove that one way or another. What we can prove is that not only are there cases of fatalities listed as covid deaths when that wasn't the direct cause, but that there were even issues of false positives from the testing, which adds even more weight to the possibility of over-reporting, not under -reporting.

We can prove that there have been more excess deaths than can be accounted for by the confirmed covid-19 fatalities.

We also know that false positives are outweighed by false negatives.