Originally posted by simplicio
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Black Americans are coming home to the GOP
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"The man from the yacht thought he was the first to find England; I thought I was the first to find Europe. I did try to found a heresy of my own; and when I had put the last touches to it, I discovered that it was orthodoxy."
GK Chesterton; Orthodoxy
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Originally posted by simplicio View PostThe party of Lincoln, or the party of backlash against civil rights?
I'm always still in trouble again
"You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
"Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
"Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman
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Originally posted by lilpixieofterror View PostIs there a backlash that we need to review laws passed 50 years ago and see if they are still reliant today?
I think it is useful to look at and review laws to see if the serve a purpose. Some laws are easy, the laws against redlining (discrimination in banking) or poll tax. But others are not so easy, such as affirmative action.
And it is worthwhile to examine the philosophical and ideological bases which allowed such laws that we reject today, and ask if the worldview went extinct in the intervening years.
Black conservatives will not flock to the Republican party until that is faced and addressed.
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Originally posted by rogue06 View PostHow about the party of the KKK, segregation, Jim Crow and filibusters against the CRA and VRA?
You pointed out that some historians argue that George Wallace was not really racist, that his iconic speeches were merely a pragmatic tactic to maintain power so that he could still push his legislative agenda for "all the good he did for black" Alabamans. Really?
Ideas generally do not just reside in parties, they reside in the electorate. The modern KKK thought they found a kindred spirit in Trump, the Republicans today. That was one lesson learned in 2017, the series of rallies to unite the right under a big, inclusive tent. So inclusive that it included the KKK.
You are right, the KKK in the past found kindred spirits and fellow travelers in the Dem Party. But what you are avoiding is that today, the party which fits that bill is the GOP. And we live in a world where there is a rising tide of authoritarian populism and right wing resurgence. The last time that happened was a century ago.
A century ago, the political institutions found themselves ill prepared to meet the challenge. And even more damnimg is the church, the Body of Christ, also were ill prepared to meet the challenge. And this generation looks back and wonders why.
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Originally posted by simplicio View PostWhat ideas existed then which made those things possible, and do they exist today? Is there an underlying backlash against civil rights today? If so, which party would they be found?
You pointed out that some historians argue that George Wallace was not really racist, that his iconic speeches were merely a pragmatic tactic to maintain power so that he could still push his legislative agenda for "all the good he did for black" Alabamans. Really?
Ideas generally do not just reside in parties, they reside in the electorate. The modern KKK thought they found a kindred spirit in Trump, the Republicans today. That was one lesson learned in 2017, the series of rallies to unite the right under a big, inclusive tent. So inclusive that it included the KKK.
You are right, the KKK in the past found kindred spirits and fellow travelers in the Dem Party. But what you are avoiding is that today, the party which fits that bill is the GOP.
And we live in a world where there is a rising tide of authoritarian populism and right wing resurgence. The last time that happened was a century ago. A century ago, the political institutions found themselves ill prepared to meet the challenge. And even more damnimg is the church, the Body of Christ, also were ill prepared to meet the challenge. And this generation looks back and wonders why.Last edited by JimL; 01-18-2020, 05:19 PM.
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Originally posted by JimL View PostIf history isn't understood, it will repeat itself. Although, even if understood, the repeat of the above could be desired by some."The man from the yacht thought he was the first to find England; I thought I was the first to find Europe. I did try to found a heresy of my own; and when I had put the last touches to it, I discovered that it was orthodoxy."
GK Chesterton; Orthodoxy
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Originally posted by simplicio View PostWhat ideas existed then which made those things possible, and do they exist today? Is there an underlying backlash against civil rights today? If so, which party would they be found?
You pointed out that some historians argue that George Wallace was not really racist, that his iconic speeches were merely a pragmatic tactic to maintain power so that he could still push his legislative agenda for "all the good he did for black" Alabamans. Really?
Ideas generally do not just reside in parties, they reside in the electorate. The modern KKK thought they found a kindred spirit in Trump, the Republicans today. That was one lesson learned in 2017, the series of rallies to unite the right under a big, inclusive tent. So inclusive that it included the KKK.
You are right, the KKK in the past found kindred spirits and fellow travelers in the Dem Party. But what you are avoiding is that today, the party which fits that bill is the GOP. And we live in a world where there is a rising tide of authoritarian populism and right wing resurgence. The last time that happened was a century ago.
A century ago, the political institutions found themselves ill prepared to meet the challenge. And even more damnimg is the church, the Body of Christ, also were ill prepared to meet the challenge. And this generation looks back and wonders why."The man from the yacht thought he was the first to find England; I thought I was the first to find Europe. I did try to found a heresy of my own; and when I had put the last touches to it, I discovered that it was orthodoxy."
GK Chesterton; Orthodoxy
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Originally posted by lilpixieofterror View PostThe KKK is a shadow of its former self. While the left wants to paint their opponents as racist, modern white liberals are some of the most racist, sexist people around. Just try being a minority or women that doesnt tote the liberal line and youll see it for yourself.
Racism existed within the conservative and Christian right back then, as well as now. Few dared to stand against the tide, and this generation looks back and wonders why.
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Originally posted by simplicio View PostYes the Klan and associated alt right are minor and small in numbers, always were.
I'm always still in trouble again
"You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
"Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
"Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman
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Originally posted by simplicio View PostYes the Klan and associated alt right are minor and small in numbers, always were. But ideologies gain power and importance through their ability to dominate the conversation. One example was the Nazi party in Germany, it skillfully manipulated and pandered to the basest of instincts in the electorate. It gained influence through the fellow traveler, the mitlaufer. Many attended Klan rallies in the twenties, and fifties, it was wholesome family entertainment with games for kids, mom, and apple pie. The Nazis offered to stand strong against communists and the weaknesses among the decadent elitists. The klan rallies presented their political chauvinism in the evenings, when the hoods came out and crosses were burnt.
Racism existed within the conservative and Christian right back then, as well as now. Few dared to stand against the tide, and this generation looks back and wonders why."The man from the yacht thought he was the first to find England; I thought I was the first to find Europe. I did try to found a heresy of my own; and when I had put the last touches to it, I discovered that it was orthodoxy."
GK Chesterton; Orthodoxy
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Originally posted by rogue06 View PostNot always. In the mid 20s it boasted somewhere between 4 to 5 million members. At the time the U.S. population was roughly 116 million meaning. While only about 4% of the population it was the biggest organization of its time.
One outcome of the Unite the right rally was that the alt right realized that they were again relegated to fringe. There purpose was to leverage influence, and they were gaining momentum through the summer of 2017. They held rallies, and many conservatives were not repulsed, until the much publicized Charlottesville rally, and the sizeable counterprotests.
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Originally posted by simplicio View PostBut their power was not from their numbers, it was from the influence they could leverage. That power, which made them the king makers and power brokers in some areas, was built on the numbers of votes they could mobilize from those sympathetic to klan ideas.
One outcome of the Unite the right rally was that the alt right realized that they were again relegated to fringe. There purpose was to leverage influence, and they were gaining momentum through the summer of 2017. They held rallies, and many conservatives were not repulsed, until the much publicized Charlottesville rally, and the sizeable counterprotests.Remember that you are dust and to dust you shall return.
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