Free Health Care For All...

[carpedm9587]

And you haven't heard even an INKLING of that from me.

Hence the term, "so many" and not "all."

[Cow Poke]

It's a matter of personal values.

So is being a hooker.

I won't pay more than I owe into the general fund.

Cool.

I will do so for SocSec, Medicare, and Medicaid. If that is "dumb" to you, then your values are apparently not the same as mine.

It's like peeing your pants in a dark suit - it gives you a warm feeling, nobody else notices, but really doesn't accomplish anything. But, hey, if it gives you a warm feeling.

[carpedm9587]

So is being a hooker.

Cool.

It's like peeing your pants in a dark suit - it gives you a warm feeling, nobody else notices, but really doesn't accomplish anything. But, hey, if it gives you a warm feeling.

Actually - no. It does accomplish something. The money paid into FICA pays today's recipients. Same with medicare/medicaid. In a manner of speaking, I'm contributing to that pool at a level that sustains essentially what my mother and her sister are taking out. If everyone has the value "pay as little as you can," it contributes to the problems we have today. I won't do that, even if the difference is fairly small (in the grand scheme of things). And my example and my sharing it has already led several of my business colleagues to engage in the same practice, magnifying the effect.

Imagine what a difference it would make if EVERYONE paid to the limit. I will be part of hopefully helping that happen. Maybe a small part - but still a part. It is something akin to sending a box of food to a starving nation. In the grand scheme of things, nobody notices and it doesn't change much...but someone on the other end will eat that food and gain another day. And someone on the other end will get a check partially paid for by my taxes. Same principle.

[Sparko]

Actually - no. It does accomplish something. The money paid into FICA pays today's recipients. Same with medicare/medicaid. In a manner of speaking, I'm contributing to that pool at a level that sustains essentially what my mother and her sister are taking out. If everyone has the value "pay as little as you can," it contributes to the problems we have today. I won't do that, even if the difference is fairly small (in the grand scheme of things). And my example and my sharing it has already led several of my business colleagues to engage in the same practice, magnifying the effect.

Imagine what a difference it would make if EVERYONE paid to the limit. I will be part of hopefully helping that happen. Maybe a small part - but still a part. It is something akin to sending a box of food to a starving nation. In the grand scheme of things, nobody notices and it doesn't change much...but someone on the other end will eat that food and gain another day. And someone on the other end will get a check partially paid for by my taxes. Same principle.

Everyone does pay the limit. FICA is a payroll tax taken out by the employer. You have no choice in how much is taken out.

Basically you are humble bragging that you take home a huge paycheck so you can pay more FICA. Thank you for paying yourself so much. Us poor people really appreciate it.

[Cow Poke]

Actually - no. It does accomplish something. The money paid into FICA pays today's recipients. Same with medicare/medicaid. In a manner of speaking, I'm contributing to that pool at a level that sustains essentially what my mother and her sister are taking out. If everyone has the value "pay as little as you can," it contributes to the problems we have today. I won't do that, even if the difference is fairly small (in the grand scheme of things). And my example and my sharing it has already led several of my business colleagues to engage in the same practice, magnifying the effect.

Imagine what a difference it would make if EVERYONE paid to the limit. I will be part of hopefully helping that happen. Maybe a small part - but still a part. It is something akin to sending a box of food to a starving nation. In the grand scheme of things, nobody notices and it doesn't change much...but someone on the other end will eat that food and gain another day. And someone on the other end will get a check partially paid for by my taxes. Same principle.

This is a "feel good" gesture at best, Carpe. You're putting your faith and trust in the US Government to be better and more efficient at helping people than you are yourself. If you're lazy, that's great - it's like writing a check instead of actually contributing. And I'm pretty certain you're not lazy in regards to actually helping people.

But, hey, if it makes you feel good, it's your money!

[carpedm9587]

Everyone does pay the limit. FICA is a payroll tax taken out by the employer. You have no choice in how much is taken out.

Unless you own the company, of course.

Basically you are humble bragging that you take home a huge paycheck so you can pay more FICA. Thank you for paying yourself so much. Us poor people really appreciate it.

Humble bragging?

Actually, what I am doing is pointing out how an S-Corp works, and the decisions faced by those of us who own one. I'm not sure how you got to the rest based on what I posted.

[carpedm9587]

This is a "feel good" gesture at best, Carpe. You're putting your faith and trust in the US Government to be better and more efficient at helping people than you are yourself.

Not in the least. SocSec, Medicare, and Medicaid are administered by publish formulas. I know exactly how the money I am contributing is distributed.

If you're lazy, that's great - it's like writing a check instead of actually contributing. And I'm pretty certain you're not lazy in regards to actually helping people.

I'm not. As I noted, I make an effort to support all four tiers of public support. My decisions around FICA/medicare/medicaid simply comprise my way of supporting the fourth and last tier.

But, hey, if it makes you feel good, it's your money!

Indeed...

[Cow Poke]

Not in the least. SocSec, Medicare, and Medicaid are administered by publish formulas. I know exactly how the money I can contributing is distributed.



I'm not. As I noted, I make an effort to support all four tiers of public support. My decisions around FICA/medicare/medicaid simply comprise my way of supporting the fourth and last tier.



Indeed...

You win - you're more awesomer than me.

[carpedm9587]

You win - you're more awesomer than me.

Of course...


I'm amazed you would even consider any other possibility...

[Sparko]

Unless you own the company, of course.



Humble bragging?

Actually, what I am doing is pointing out how an S-Corp works, and the decisions faced by those of us who own one. I'm not sure how you got to the rest based on what I posted.

Basically you were claiming that you take home a larger salary than your accountant advised you to so you could pay more FICA taxes.

Under the law, an S Corp (which flows directly through to personal taxes) requires the principal to take a "reasonable wage." Reasonable is not specifically defined. I have been advised many times by my accountant to take as low a wage as I possibly can and still be "reasonable," so as to reduce my FICA/Medicare/Medicaid taxes. Draws on the company are not subject to FICA/Medicaid/Medicare taxes (though they are subject to income taxes). What is paid into FICA today pays the people of today, and the SocSec trust fund is showing strain. A simillar situation exists for Medicare/Medicaid. So I regularly reject my accountant's advice, take all of my income as salary, and end up paying the maximum amount of FICA/Medicare/Medicaid taxes possible each year. In the ten years I've been running my business, the total is substantial.

[carpedm9587]

Basically you were claiming that you take home a larger salary than your accountant advised you to so you could pay more FICA taxes.

Actually, no. My income stays the same. It is HOW I bring it home that matters. To give an example with numbers, if my income in one year were $200K (it's not, that's a made-up number), as the principle and sole stock holder of an S-Corp, I could look around at the salaries of people who do my kind of work, and pay myself the lowest salary I find (which would be about $60K). I could then take the rest of the $140K as a draw on the company. That would still show as income, but it is more in line with capital gains than salary, so it is subject to income tax but not to FICA/medicare/medicaid taxes. I would pay THOSE taxes on the $60K only. If I take the entire $200K as salary, the entire amount is taxed for medicare/medicaid, and I pay the max FICA rate. The difference is several thousand $ per year.

I ignore my accountant's advise because I find that kind of "dodging" and that kind of "loophole" unethical. It's perfectly legal, but the fact is I am using a loophole to avoid paying a tax that directly benefits others, and those benefits are already in danger because of the state of the various trust funds that support them. I sleep better knowing I am doing my part to the best of my ability.

I suppose it's hard to have this discussion without coming across as "bragging." I guess I'll have to live with that danger.

[Sparko]

Actually, no. My income stays the same. It is HOW I bring it home that matters. To give an example with numbers, if my income in one year were $200K (it's not, that's a made-up number), as the principle and sole stock holder of an S-Corp, I could look around at the salaries of people who do my kind of work, and pay myself the lowest salary I find (which would be about $60K). I could then take the rest of the $140K as a draw on the company. That would still show as income, but it is more in line with capital gains than salary, so it is subject to income tax but not to FICA/medicare/medicaid taxes. I would pay THOSE taxes on the $60K only. If I take the entire $200K as salary, the entire amount is taxed for medicare/medicaid, and I pay the max FICA rate. The difference is several thousand $ per year.

I ignore my accountant's advise because I find that kind of "dodging" and that kind of "loophole" unethical. It's perfectly legal, but the fact is I am using a loophole to avoid paying a tax that directly benefits others, and those benefits are already in danger because of the state of the various trust funds that support them. I sleep better knowing I am doing my part to the best of my ability.

I suppose it's hard to have this discussion without coming across as "bragging." I guess I'll have to live with that danger.

Ah OK now I understand. sorry for the confusion.

[carpedm9587]

Ah OK now I understand. sorry for the confusion.

NP

[Cow Poke]

I suppose it's hard to have this discussion without coming across as "bragging." I guess I'll have to live with that danger.

You people who act so cotton-pickin' humble and good are a real pain to those of us who really are!

[carpedm9587]

You people who act so cotton-pickin' humble and good are a real pain to those of us who really are!

It's all done with mirrors and a bit of smoke...