Op Ed by Will Hurd, Republican, On Trump

[oxmixmudd]

Considering how far over the top the left's criticism has gone it's not surprising that many folks have a desire to push back even if they might feel a need to shower afterwards.

I don't buy that as a valid excuse when we are dealing with issues of this magnitude. It is in fact very childish. It's time for the adults in the room to start acting like adults, put country before party and find out what this fellow is really up to.

The ties Trump has to russia are a problem. Any normal person seeking access to secure data with the issues he has would be flatly denied w/o a verifiable and ironclad explanation. And I guarantee you any normal person exhibiting his behavior and holding a clearance would very likely lose it.

And we can't excuse this because we don't like Hillary..


Jim

[Sparko]

I don't buy that as a valid excuse when we are dealing with issues of this magnitude. It is in fact very childish. It's time for the adults in the room to start acting like adults, put country before party and find out what this fellow is really up to.

The ties Trump has to russia are a problem. Any normal person seeking access to secure data with the issues he has would be flatly denied w/o a verifiable and ironclad explanation. And I guarantee you any normal person exhibiting his behavior and holding a clearance would very likely lose it.

And we can't excuse this because we don't like Hillary..


Jim

When I see some actual evidence of Trump's "ties to Russia" and "collusion with Russia" instead of innuendo and rumors, then I will say something. I don't want a President who is under Putin's thumb any more than any other American. But so far all I have seen is a smear campaign started by Hillary and continued by acting officials in Congress and the FBI with no actual evidence at all. In fact, so far everything has backfired on them and we have seen official after official resign or go under investigation on the Democrat side.

[Mountain Man]

"I have not seen one scintilla of evidence that this president colluded, conspired, confederated with Russia, and neither has anyone else, or you may rest assured Adam Schiff would have leaked it."
-Rep. Trey Gowdy

[Sparko]

"I have not seen one scintilla of evidence that this president colluded, conspired, confederated with Russia, and neither has anyone else, or you may rest assured Adam Schiff would have leaked it."
-Rep. Trey Gowdy

I like Gowdy. He is a no-holds-barred country gentleman. Says it the way it is, with style.

[rogue06]

I don't buy that as a valid excuse when we are dealing with issues of this magnitude. It is in fact very childish. It's time for the adults in the room to start acting like adults, put country before party and find out what this fellow is really up to.

The ties Trump has to russia are a problem. Any normal person seeking access to secure data with the issues he has would be flatly denied w/o a verifiable and ironclad explanation. And I guarantee you any normal person exhibiting his behavior and holding a clearance would very likely lose it.

And we can't excuse this because we don't like Hillary..


Jim

It is when so much of the stuff said is a tattered web of deception, fraud and lies. The whole Russian collusion thing has crashed like a house of cards in a windstorm yet the MSM keeps mindlessly regurgitating it hoping if they say it enough that it might magically become true -- or at least that they can convince the gullible that it is (remember the slip by Mika Brzezinski on MSNBC about how it's the MSM's "job" to "control exactly what people think"?).

Rumors and unsubstantiated claims are repeatedly stated as "fact." During previous Administrations this was the territory of obscure bloggers but now it's breathlessly done by supposedly respectable journalists and Congressmen.

One of the biggest complaints about Trump is that he's a loud-mouth, uncouth lout. That he's rude, crude and lewd. And I cannot disagree with that. But the reality of the situation is that being polite and well-mannered has not helped a whit when dealing with the left.

Look at Romney for example. He is the epitome of being civil, respectful and graceful. A true gentleman. And the left (including the MSM) still savaged him and characterized him as being an ogre. Former Senate Minority Leader Harry Reid was quite proud of how he lied through his teeth about Romney not paying income taxes later boasting with a smirk "it worked didn't it?" In many ways George W. Bush was the same way. Too polite to deign to respond to scurrilous lies. He was above all that.

So along comes Trump. Who has never claimed to be a choirboy. Who is a bare knuckled street brawler -- and far more skilled at it than his opponents. And many of the Republicans in control are furious with him because of that. What's more is that he is actually getting things done. Folks are grading him not on what he says but what he does.

[Teallaura]

I can see why people voted Trump. They live in a two party system, and if they're strongly anti-abortion then they're hardly going to vote for a party which isn't anti-abortion (Dems). So far so good.

What I dont understand is why they continue to defend seemingly indefensible things he does & says. Nothing wrong with saying he was the least of two bad choices, but I don't get why people then go and defend him (or why they don't argue against those that do defend him) - I'm specifically speaking of those who claim to have held their noses, rather than actual Trump supporters like MM and his ilk.

Leaving the whole 'everybody on both sides is fed up' thing aside, the main reason is simple - they want actual progress. It's also the reason for the 'attack Trump no matter what' insanity from the Dems - the hope is to split the base against a president that didn't exactly get in because everybody loved and respected him. Republicans, on the other hand, instinctively know that if they split (again) they lose a big opportunity to make actual changes.

Some do it holding their noses - most don't think it through that much - but the actual answer to your question is power. For once, social conservatives would like to see that power exercised on their behalf - very unlike Trump's conservative predecessors. Trump's business acumen serves him well here even if it makes for political farce - he's giving the customers what they want.

[Teallaura]

I don't buy that as a valid excuse when we are dealing with issues of this magnitude. It is in fact very childish. It's time for the adults in the room to start acting like adults, put country before party and find out what this fellow is really up to.

The ties Trump has to russia are a problem. Any normal person seeking access to secure data with the issues he has would be flatly denied w/o a verifiable and ironclad explanation. And I guarantee you any normal person exhibiting his behavior and holding a clearance would very likely lose it.

And we can't excuse this because we don't like Hillary..


Jim

He wasn't elected to be Lincoln - it seems unwise to try to make him into something he is not.

As for the OP, he backtracked. Maybe it was calculated, maybe a screw up, maybe a little of both - but he did recant within an extremely (politically speaking) short period of time. Maybe it was a horrible blunder as the OP argues - but what is it you want? A president who never makes mistakes? He doesn't exist. A president that isn't a bombastic brawler? Unfortunately, you have to wait your turn on that. A president that takes it to heart and tries not to repeat that mistake? For that, we'll have to wait and see.

[oxmixmudd]

When I see some actual evidence of Trump's "ties to Russia" and "collusion with Russia" instead of innuendo and rumors, then I will say something. I don't want a President who is under Putin's thumb any more than any other American. But so far all I have seen is a smear campaign started by Hillary and continued by acting officials in Congress and the FBI with no actual evidence at all. In fact, so far everything has backfired on them and we have seen official after official resign or go under investigation on the Democrat side.

For 'ties to Russia' you'd need to be blind not to see it. Manafort, Flynn, etc.

Let's see, instead of me writing a list, here is a link to the known personal and buisiness ties to Putin's russia. So please, no more silly assertions there are no ties between trump and Russia

https://www.politico.com/magazine/st...essions-214868



As for direct evidence of collusion, clearly if it is known it has not been released yet. The op is not about prosecutable evidence, it is about the fact trump behaves as one who is being manipulated by the Russian government to such a degree a former CIA operative now a Republican congressman is concerned enough to stake his career on his assessment Trump is compromised.

Jim

[Teallaura]

For 'ties to Russia' you'd need to be blind not to see it. Mamfort, Flynn, etc.

Let's see, instead of me writing a list, here is a link to the known personal and buisiness ties to Putin's russia. So please, no more silly assertions there are no ties between trump and Russia

https://www.politico.com/magazine/st...essions-214868



As for direct evidence of collusion, clearly if it is known it has not been released yet. The op is about the fact trump behaves as one who c is being manipulated by the Russian government.

Jim

It reads like one of those 'six degrees of separation' things except that I didn't see Kevin Bacon on it.

[rogue06]

All that could be answered by comparing it to the last Administration. From whispering to Putin's puppet to tell him you will be more flexible after the election to giving him control of 20% of our uranium.

[JimL]

When I see some actual evidence of Trump's "ties to Russia" and "collusion with Russia" instead of innuendo and rumors, then I will say something. I don't want a President who is under Putin's thumb any more than any other American. But so far all I have seen is a smear campaign started by Hillary and continued by acting officials in Congress and the FBI with no actual evidence at all. In fact, so far everything has backfired on them and we have seen official after official resign or go under investigation on the Democrat side.

You won't see the actual evidence, because you don't want to see it. The evidence is, and has been, right in front of your stupid faces, but you can't see it. What you actually want is not evidence, but actual and absolute proof before your thick headed minds might be changed, and I'm not even sure that absolute proof would do the trick. Oh, btw, do you know what you call it when you invite 8 russians to Trump tower in order to obtain dirt on Hillary Clinton in exchange for ending the Magnitsky sanctions against Russian oligarchs and then, when the covert attempt gets out, have the President himself construct a lie as explanation. It's called collusion/conspiracy. That's just a tiny bit of the evidence thats been put in front of you.

[Starlight]

You won't see the actual evidence, because you don't want to see it. The evidence is, and has been, right in front of your stupid faces, but you can't see it. What you actually want is not evidence, but actual and absolute proof before your thick headed minds might be changed, and I'm not even sure that absolute proof would do the trick. Oh, btw, do you know what you call it when you invite 8 russians to Trump tower in order to obtain dirt on Hillary Clinton in exchange for ending the Magnitsky sanctions against Russian oligarchs and then, when the covert attempt gets out, have the President himself construct a lie as explanation. It's called collusion/conspiracy. That's just a tiny bit of the evidence thats been put in front of you.

Yeah it's not like the president's son published the incriminating emails on Twitter of the Trump campaign colluding with the Russians... oh wait, yes that's exactly what he did.

[oxmixmudd]

It reads like one of those 'six degrees of separation' things except that I didn't see Kevin Bacon on it.

Did you even try to read or understand the content of the link? Or is you mind made up and the facts don't matter and your only goal is to make jokes?

Jim

[Teallaura]

Did you even try to read or understand the content of the link? Or is you mind made up and the facts don't matter and your only goal is to make jokes?

Jim

I read it - but it's a lot of innuendo and not a heck of a lot of substance. Governments and officials talk to each other extensively - a couple meetings does not equal collusion. A guy with international business holdings is going to have connections to other countries - that's unavoidable. so yeah, there are connections - Sparky might find that problematic but I don't because it's proof of nothing.

I doubt it would be possible to find any political figure with no connections outside the US - unless they are very newly elected. One or two that might be problematic certainly bears consideration - but it's not proof of anything, least of all collusion. It's a chicken little argument - something bopping you on the head is not the sky falling - necessarily.

There might be evidence that I would find compelling - but that chart isn't it. And I wasn't joking - it literally reads the same as the 'separation' charts that were so popular a while back. That doesn't make it compelling - quite the opposite.

Other than 'connects to Russia' show me cause to be concerned about these connections - because this brush is way too broad and would tar every president back to Washington.

[Teallaura]

You won't see the actual evidence, because you don't want to see it. The evidence is, and has been, right in front of your stupid faces, but you can't see it. What you actually want is not evidence, but actual and absolute proof before your thick headed minds might be changed, and I'm not even sure that absolute proof would do the trick. Oh, btw, do you know what you call it when you invite 8 russians to Trump tower in order to obtain dirt on Hillary Clinton in exchange for ending the Magnitsky sanctions against Russian oligarchs and then, when the covert attempt gets out, have the President himself construct a lie as explanation. It's called collusion/conspiracy. That's just a tiny bit of the evidence thats been put in front of you.

I literally would have preferred Mickey Mouse to Trump (and I'm not a Mickey fan) but I'm not seeing this - it looks to me like both sides are to a degree 'seeing what they want to see' - but as far as evidence, there's not anything resembling a smoking gun - or there would already be impeachment proceedings being drawn up.