Should Al Franken Resign?

[carpedm9587]

And brevity. Did I mention brevity?



The mind can only absorb what the seat can endure.

And the seat can only absorb what the mind can endure

[Teallaura]

I don't disagree completely.

(parse THAT one )

I agree that the reciever should be willing to receive the communication, or the entire effort is fruitless. However, if I have a mssage to communicate - thge primary responsibility, IMO, is on me to ensure that my communication is framed in the way most likely to achieve my desired results.

I am a teacher by profession. I cannot teach someone who is unwilling to learn. But I CAN cause a person who is absolutely willing to learn to fail to do so by not structuring my message correctly. I have a responsibility, as the source of the message, to do everything I can to ensure the message is correctly received. If I fail to do so - and the message is not correctly recieved, I need look no further than myself.

And the listener is still at fault when presuming malice where none exists.

[One Bad Pig]

Cir is a great guy but his spelling took a left turn at Albuquerque sometimes. Hence : rasberry; instead of :raspberry:

IIRC we had a limit of eight characters for the standard smilies, so he had to leave a letter out for that one.

[Cow Poke]

IIRC we had a limit of eight characters for the standard smilies, so he had to leave a letter out for that one.

He coulda left out one of the "r"s Maybe that first one!

[Teallaura]

IIRC we had a limit of eight characters for the standard smilies, so he had to leave a letter out for that one.

I thought it was just that he didn't like the letter P - which would explain part of how he spelled 'yippee"... No idea why the i showed up...

[JonathanL]

I had no idea "argg" was spelt with an h...

"Argh" is spelt with an h. I'm not sure I've ever seen the variant "argg" ever before in my life.

[JonathanL]

I wanna trophy!

You're not supposed to verbify "trophy".

[One Bad Pig]

You're not supposed to verbify "trophy".

I'd much rather trophy than atrophy.

[rogue06]

And a huge part of that is knowing your audience, and being able to discern how receptive they are. But, primarily, it's on the communicator, not the communicatee.

Kinda sorta reminds me of the adage from Sun Tzu in his Art of War: "If words of command are not clear and distinct, if orders are not thoroughly understood, then the general is to blame. But, if orders are clear and the soldiers nevertheless disobey, then it is the fault of their officers."

[Starlight]

But, primarily, it's on the communicator, not the communicatee.

I generally agree.

However, with biblical interpretation there's quite a lot on the communicatee. Although I totally grant that in many passages of the bible the communicator has done a very poor job. e.g. Paul is a particularly poor communicator at times.

[Cow Poke]

I generally agree.

However, with biblical interpretation there's quite a lot on the communicatee. Although I totally grant that in many passages of the bible the communicator has done a very poor job. e.g. Paul is a particularly poor communicator at times.

You never miss an opportunity to inject your anti-Christian hate anywhere.

[Bill the Cat]

I generally agree.

However, with biblical interpretation there's quite a lot on the communicatee. Although I totally grant that in many passages of the bible the communicator has done a very poor job. e.g. Paul is a particularly poor communicator at times.

Maybe to us outsiders, but to his audience, more than likely they understood exactly what Paul was saying.

[carpedm9587]

"Argh" is spelt with an h. I'm not sure I've ever seen the variant "argg" ever before in my life.

Ohh...

[carpedm9587]

And the listener is still at fault when presuming malice where none exists.

Yes - with that I agree completely. As I noted before - if the listener has already adopted a posture of "I am not going to listen to this person," using any of the various ways that can be accomplished, then the communicator is wasting his/her time.

Look - it DOES take two people to successfully communicate: a communicator willing to make the effort to craft the message in a way it will be best understood, and a receiver open to receiving the message and parsing it in good faith. And the failure of either of those will fail the communication. The reason I tend to emphasize the role of the communicator is that this is the person wanting to transmit a message (setting aside times when the receiver is requesting the information). If they are not willing to work to craft the message in a way that can be received with minimal distortion, they don't have a prayer of achieving their goal. The very attempt to communicate is essentially a waste of time. Being willing to do that doesn't mean that the communication is guaranteed to succeed - but it DOES mean they've done the best they can to achieve success. The rest is up to the receiver.

I often use a four quadrant matrix for decision making purposes. When I apply it to this discussion, I get this:

Communication.jpg

What it tells me is, if I want to be successful communicating a message, I have no hope if I craft it in a way the other side cannot receive, so it behooves me, the communicator, to craft my message as best I can, and the rest is up to the receiver. That means the right language (e.g., English if they speak English), but it also means avoiding words I know will trigger the other person (my use of "slavery" in the abortion discussion is a great example of how NOT to do this).

When I apply this observation to the current political climate, I come away with the distinct impression that people are not actually trying to convince and convert anymore. They are not TRULY trying to communicate to the other side. If they were, they would look for ways to craft the message to appeal to the listener and convince/convert them. Communication has become internal - people talking into their own bubbles to people who think like them with the goal of beefing up their existing mindsets. If there is a dynamic at the heart of our polarization today, that seems to me to be it.

[Sparko]

Cir is a great guy but his spelling took a left turn at Albuquerque sometimes. Hence : rasberry; instead of :raspberry:

and we can't fix it because then it breaks it in all of the old posts.