DJT and TDS

[carpedm9587]

Don't you already have a thread on DJT?

I have a thread about the DJT stock. This one is about TDS.

Is it expected that any DJT-related topic needs to be in the same thread?

[Mountain Man]

The only ones who are actually Trump deranged aka having TDS, are those of you who continue to ignore his lies, his tax fraud, his own election fraud, or his attempt to overthrow the will of the people, his grifting, his attempted coup, his incitement of an insurrection, his dereliction of duty in failing to put down the insurrection (whether you want to call it just a riot or not), not to mention his giving aid and comfort to the Seditious Conspirators and insurrectionist, even until this day, calling them heros and hostages, promising to pardon them if re-elected. And last, but certainly not least, being the first President in American history to end the "Peaceful Tranfer of Power" which is what this country and democracy itself is founded upon and which until this very day he has still never conceded. There is no better definition of "deranged" than people who knowingly refuse to accept in their face facts and who would rather feign ignorance and continue to support a treasonous fascist than to acknowledge the truth and admit that they were wrong all this time and that they could have been duped for so long a time.
Thats what's "deranged," not the people that have been trying to snap you out of your TDS stupor.

[carpedm9587]

I've stated on multiple occasions I dislike Trump and think he's dumb, and no one has ever once accused me of TDS.

What do you think this signifies?

[carpedm9587]

I'd ignore any accusations of the term. It's a calculated phrase to deflect any criticism of him in lieu of actually arguing points being made.

I generally agree, and won't usually respond to its use in an active conversation. But I thought the topic in general merited a post. It also gave me an opportunity to lay out in a bit more detail my opposition to Mr. Trump.

[carpedm9587]

Bringing up TDS isn't an attempt to deflect from whatever argument is being made (though I suppose some might bring it up as a deflection), but rather it is usually brought up in the cases where someone continually injects Trump into any conversation or post even if he is not relevant to the topic at hand. In other words, Trump shapes their thinking to such a degree that he is all they think about. In other words,

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I can assure you that Mr. Trump is not all that I think about. But I have decided that I am going to take time, each day, to put together a post outlining issues related to this man, in the hopes that I will influence some of the lurkers in the various sites where I post. Right now, it's the primary thing I can do, and I am seriously concerned about the threat this man poses to our nation.

Given that he is one of the two candidates likely to be in the Oval Office come next January, it seems that the time is warranted.

[carpedm9587]

An example of TDS would be JimL's and oxmixmudd's long screeds about how Trump is a fascist and Hitler and the country is in grave danger with him as president, and lying about things he said and did that he never said or did. They would be the extreme examples of TDS. It's above and beyond dislike or criticisms of Trump, to the point of being unreasonable and irrational. And that seems to have affected a large segment of the population, which is very strange, and almost like it's some form of brainwashing.

An interesting response. It might (or might not) be a surprise to you that this is exactly how a lot of left-leaning people see most of Trump's base: as brainwashed, unreasonable, and irrational. I would dearly love to find one good person who insists on supporting Mr. Trump who can explain to me how they can justify that position. Every single conversation I have attempted to have, in any venue, with any Trump supporter, dries up and ends as soon as I ask a question or ask for evidence that supports one claim or another. All I've gotten, for years now, is one meme after another.

Somewhere out there, I have to believe, is a thoughtful, reasoning Trump supporter. I wish I could find them.

[carpedm9587]

Those are good, but there are simpler tests.

• Does someone we should expect to support him express the same concern?
• Did the TDS accuser express the same concern prior to his election.

The second is additionally valuable in locating instances of projection.

The fact that I use my "put the words in someone else's mouth" test doesn't mean I don't other things as well. Indeed, the first one you list here is another test I commonly use. My answer is an unequivocal "yes." The list of people who should be supporting Trump and have turned against him is extensive. It includes good men like John Kelly, Robert Mueller, Colin Powell (before he passed), and a long list of people who worked in the Trump administration, to name just a few. Most of them are people who's political views I do not share, but there is no reason for me to question the patriotism and integrity of these people. Yet the response to them as they report what they have seen, by the vast majority of Trump's supporters, is to simply smear them as disloyal and call into question their service and their patriotism.

I'm not sure I completely understand your second test, however. If I have just engaged with someone, how would I know what they said prior to Mr. Trump's election?

I consider Mr. Trump to be an existential threat to our country. I think, if he is re-elected, this country will be unrecognizable after four years. I think he has shown, adequately, his love for strong-men dictators and his rejection of the basic norms of a democracy, in other words, his autocratic tendencies. He SAYS differently, but what he DOES flies in the face of his claims to loving democracy and patriotism. And he has said and done things that would have terminated the political careers of almost anyone else. The day when a candidate lost the chance at the presidency because they plagiarized a few words is now a quaint memory, and our nation is the poorer for it.

[seanD]

An interesting response. It might (or might not) be a surprise to you that this is exactly how a lot of left-leaning people see most of Trump's base: as brainwashed, unreasonable, and irrational. I would dearly love to find one good person who insists on supporting Mr. Trump who can explain to me how they can justify that position. Every single conversation I have attempted to have, in any venue, with any Trump supporter, dries up and ends as soon as I ask a question or ask for evidence that supports one claim or another. All I've gotten, for years now, is one meme after another.

Somewhere out there, I have to believe, is a thoughtful, reasoning Trump supporter. I wish I could find them.

It would depend on what you mean by "brainwashed, unreasonable, and irrational." You'd have to give an example, much like I gave. I can call Trump dumb and narcissistic and say I don't like the man, like I've done multiple times here, yet still be called a Trumpster or Trumper or be accused of Idolizing Trump by folks like JimL and Ox. Would you consider a person like that reasonable and rational?

[carpedm9587]

What? He's just objectively appraising this odious figure and all of his cultish minions. It's not his fault that you've misconstrued these two long-winded negative threads he's started about him, after his apparent long absence.

And now I would like to objectively analyze this senile corrupt puppet of a POTUS that we have destroying our country. I'll let you know what I come up with.

What evidence do you have to offer that Mr. Biden is "senile?" And specifically what has he done that is "destroying our country?"

[Sam]

And? Trump had divested from his business ventures and was losing money the entire time he served as your president, and there is zero evidence that his polices were influenced by payments from foreign governments. On the contrary -- and since your quote mentioned them -- Saudi Arabia was not at all happy with your President ramping up US oil production and driving down prices globally, and your President's tariffs against China and attempts to steer US production away from them nearly broke their financial back.

So, yeah, these ridiculous hysterics about Truth Social stock are much ado about literally nothing.

Trump infamously refused to divest from his business ventures as president, which is why he owned a hotel in the capital during his term.

Amazed to hear how unhappy the Saudi government was at Trump, seeing as how his son-in-law/WH advisor immediately went on to secure billions of dollars in investment capital from the same.

-Sam

[carpedm9587]

A textbook example of Trump Derangement Syndrome is condemning President Trump with the baseless accusation that foreign governments might try and influence him during his second term by purchasing Truth Social stock.

Actually, MM, it is not "baseless." The avenues for channeling money to Mr. Trump using the DJT stock as a vehicle are relatively clear and supported by law. The fact that Mr. Trump never separated himself from his business dealings (as previous presidents and office holders have done) is well documented. The fact that Mr. Trump received monies via his existing businesses from foreign countries and companies is also well documented. It is not a stretch to see this as a new possible avenue for him to further enrich himself using a meme stock for a business that is grossly over-valued. These are all reasonable observations - and reasonable possibilities. At no point was this put forward as a certainty - merely a concerning possibility. In the case of Mr. Trump, given his history, I would say it is more than possible - I would say it is very probable.

[seanD]

What do you think this signifies?

It contradicts what KG said: "It's a calculated phrase to deflect any criticism of him in lieu of actually arguing points being made." If that were true then I would have been accused of having TDS.

[carpedm9587]

I'm still not seeing anything that would support the wild eyed conspiracy theory that foreign governments will use purchases of Truth Social stock to influence President Trump in his second term. Remember when liberals were whooping and hollering about Trump's hotel in Washington DC, basically making the same accusation, and nothing came of it?

In fact, as I recall, Trump actually lost money as president because he divested from his businesses, and he donated his presidential salary. Imagine that, a politician not using his position to enrich himself! If only more people in Washington had that kind of integrity.

Mr. Trump more than replaced the minor salary (about $400K/year) with lavishly expensive trips to his own golf courses, was documented requiring executive branch travelers to stay at his properties and charging well beyond the normal per diem for these stays, and had family members abroad doing exactly what everyone is so outraged that Hunter Biden did: leverage the Trump name to make business deals and grow Mr. Trump's wealth (as well as their own). The Trump Cabinet had more turnover due to scandal than pretty much any cabinet in the past century. The number of people associated with Mr. Trump (campaign staff, legal staff, administration staff) who ended up going to jail for one reason or another - directly related to his candidacy and presidency exceeds pretty much any administration in the past century.

That you can see this man as one iota of integrity is rather stunning to me. And he did NOT divest himself of his businesses; he turned over control of them to his children. There is a difference.

[carpedm9587]

Right, I didn't support him in the first primary or the second, and I'm a Trumper...

I want to be clear: I have not called anyone here a "Trumper." My comments have been generic concerning "most members of Trump's Base." It is not for me to tell someone else that they are or are not a "Trumper."

But I do believe that the vast majority of Mr. Trump's base have been badly conned, and they are in denial about the risk this man poses to our country. I am now a full-time RVer, and most of where I go is rural locations, where support for Mr. Trump is extremely strong. Most of the people I encounter, even when I know they support Mr. Trump, have impressed me as good, kind, and generous people. They have helped me when I needed help (as a newbie RVer with a big rig) and I have helped some of them in turn. Most of the time, the topic of politics does not come up.

When it does, the language is riddled with "libtard" and "<expletive> Biden" and threats of civil war if their candidate does not win. I searched online, and there are also "<expletive> Trump" products. Interestingly, I have never ever seen a single one of them in any public venue (and yes, I do go into cities as well). But the "<expletive> Biden" is everywhere. Sometimes it takes the form of "You Go Brandon." I see at least a couple at every single stop - and I move weekly. I have serious concerns about the kind of behavior and language that Mr. Trump has normalized.

[carpedm9587]

It contradicts what KG said: "It's a calculated phrase to deflect any criticism of him in lieu of actually arguing points being made." If that were true then I would have been accused of having TDS.

Hmm...not sure I agree. TDS is clearly a pejorative, and tossed out to dismiss what the person is saying as irrelevant because it is the product of some kind of mental disorder. The fact that this is how and why it is almost always used does not translate that it should have been used in reference to you.

All dogs have four legs does not mean everything with four legs is a dog.

Likewise, TDS is a pejorative to demean those who speak against Trump does not mean all who speak against Trump will be demeaned by the TDS appellation.

Or am I missing something...?