Wisconsin Man Charged with pro-life pregnancy center Firebombing

[Cow Poke]

And yours is the deepest hatred of all CP.

Of course, Jim.

It goes so deep in you that civil conversation on any topic between us - for even one or two posts - is completely impossible.

Well, GEEEESH, Jim, when you enter a thread by kicking everybody in the teeth, what do you want, chocolates and roses?

[CivilDiscourse]

Of course, Jim.



Well, GEEEESH, Jim, when you enter a thread by kicking everybody in the teeth, what do you want, chocolates and roses?

I've asked jim to drop his pity party, don't pile it into him, get the thread back on topic.

[Cow Poke]

I've asked jim to drop his pity party, don't pile it into him, get the thread back on topic.

Yeah, I saw that after I posted.

[oxmixmudd]

We don't hate you, Jim. We are bewildered by your behaviour, which is different from how you were when you were first here.

Mossy, if you and others could react rationally to me when I am posting calmly and thoughtfully as I have in this thread, I'd think you might have a point. But you and others can't. Once again the conversation has been turned from the topic to the personal vilification of who I am. I was talking about a trend in the posts that represents a paranoia. A paranoia that is endemic in conservative circles and that was driving the conversation about the conviction.

But now those I was talking to have decided they would rather change the conversation from the (I believe paranoid) belief that pro-life violence is tolerated to a discussion of why the people responding to me despise it when I post.

That is hatred mossy. That is what hatred does. It tries to destroy, demean, diminish, insult, and crush the object of the emotion. You and others need to face it for what it is.

I absolutely guarantee you that if those of you filled with hatred aimed my way could ever let go of it, my presence in your threads would immediately cease to be so disruptive. There is nothing in what I have said so far in this thread that rationally should have devolved to this point.

And yet it has.

[CivilDiscourse]

Mossy, if you and others could react rationally to me when I am posting calmly and thoughtfully as I have in this thread, I'd think you might have a point. But you and others can't. Once again the conversation has been turned from the topic to the personal vilification of who I am. I was talking about a trend in the posts that represents a paranoia. A paranoia that is endemic in conservative circles and that was driving the conversation about the conviction.

But now those I was talking to have decided they would rather change the conversation from the (I believe paranoid) belief that pro-life violence is tolerated to a discussion of why the people responding to me despise it when I post.

That is hatred mossy. That is what hatred does. It tries to destroy, demean, diminish, insult, and crush the object of the emotion. You and others need to face it for what it is.

I absolutely guarantee you that if those of you filled with hatred aimed my way could ever let go of it, my presence in your threads would immediately cease to be so disruptive. There is nothing in what I have said so far in this thread that rationally should have devolved to this point.

And yet it has.

That's 2.

Last chance. Stop the pity party or get out.

[oxmixmudd]

That's 2.

Last chance. Stop the pity party or get out.

Time delays/latency in reading and posting only CD. But thanks for 3 chances.

[oxmixmudd]

Let's take a look at your initial post, i.e. your first foray into the discussion:



Look what I claimed:

However, I will say that among many liberals (like you) there is often a rush when something like this happens to ignore it, downplay it, attack those who highlight it, or jump right into notasbadism.

Your first post is all about attacking those highlighting this case.

I didn't say you did all of it, I said that they did any of those, and you directly did. As for "ignoring it" you mentioned it only in the context of attacking other posters. You made no real comment on the subject of the thread itself. You made no comment on the firebombing, or the firebomber.

So, I would say it's safe to say you ignored it...though individual mileage may vary. You definitely cared less about the actual original post than you did attacking other posters.

I don't see it that way CD I was reacting to those specifically and in this thread claiming this case represents something odd or abnormal. I listed 4 of those responses. But reality is, it doesn't represent anything odd or abnormal. But the perception it is odd or abnormal I believe is sourced in the underlying perception that somehow violence against pro life people or facilities is not prosecuted or excused by law enforcement.

And we have seen that same sentiment expressed in this forum before, I don't know exactly how many threads. But there are other threads here that claim the administration or law enforcement is unbalanced in its enforcement of laws surrounding events related to the abortion issue.

[CivilDiscourse]

I don't see it that way CD I was reacting to those specifically and in this thread claiming this case represents something odd or abnormal. I listed 4 of those responses. But reality is, it doesn't represent anything odd or abnormal. But the perception it is odd or abnormal I believe is sourced in the underlying perception that somehow violence against pro life people or facilities is not prosecuted or excused by law enforcement.

And we have seen that same sentiment expressed in this forum before, I don't know exactly how many threads. But there are other threads here that claim the administration or law enforcement is unbalanced in its enforcement of laws surrounding events related to the abortion issue.

Frankly, I don't care to discuss the 'paranoia' of other posters. I posted this because left wing extremism doesn't get the attention it deserves. People look away, coverage of it, if it happens, is often very short and then fades away. We had someone try to assassinate a SCOTUS judge due to rhetoric from the left. But, people want to point and go "The bigger threat is the right!!!!" and use that as an excuse to ignore stuff that comes from the left. Steve Scalisce wasn't shot any less because "the right does more!" These firebombings aren't made less because a pro-choice person bombed a clinic in the past. These deserve the spotlight just as much.

[Mountain Man]

Because, the paranoia that our justice department is actively and internally weaponized for political and ideological purposes is one of the most dangerous sorts of paranoia facing society. People are excusing lawlessness behaviour, even the exposure and mishandling of top secret material at the very highest classifications, information judged to cause exceptionally grave damage to our nation's security and intelligence gathering methods if discovered by our enemies, an account of this very same irrational paranoia.

We have to find a way to return to reality in our politics, to recognize that the majority of the people on both sides are in fact decent people looking for what is best for all of us, and being able to debate differences of opinion about how to do that under that presumption.

Abortion itself is a place ruled by the extremes, where both sides see the other as veritable demons without morals or compassion.

You sound paranoid.

[CivilDiscourse]

You sound paranoid.

Don't go back down that road. I just got us out of pity party mode, don't go back down there.

[rogue06]

Don't go back down that road. I just got us out of pity party mode, don't go back down there.

Dagnabbit. And I just picked up the balloons.

[oxmixmudd]

Frankly, I don't care to discuss the 'paranoia'of other posters[*]. I posted this because left wing extremism doesn't get the attention it deserves. People look away, coverage of it, if it happens, is often very short and then fades away. We had someone try to assassinate a SCOTUS judge due to rhetoric from the left. But, people want to point and go "The bigger threat is the right!!!!" and use that as an excuse to ignore stuff that comes from the left. Steve Scalisce wasn't shot any less because "the right does more!" These firebombings aren't made less because a pro-choice person bombed a clinic in the past. These deserve the spotlight just as much.

"The bigger threat is the right" is something I have yet to get a clear answer on wrt abortion. Other areas I think it is clear. But abortion had been legal since 1972, so nearly all protest activity, and violence, was on the right. That biases the statistics on that issue in that we have yet to really see to what extent violence will be part of the response of the left to restrictions on abortion. So far the majority appears to be legal challenges and passive resistance like providing anonymity to people seeking abortion out of state.

It does seem to me though that the legal attempts to punish those seeking help out of state even in cases of incest or rape rises to the level of a sort of violence, or at least of oppression from the right.

* My point about paranoia was much broader than any individual person, I see it as an amplification to a dangerous proportion of an undercurrent that has long been part of the conservative voting block. The idea I'm trying to attack individual posters here by discussing it is misguided.