Prepubescent "Transgender Activist"

[Sparko]

You don't just have claims. We have studies done on the effectiveness of treatment. We have doctors and patients who have found treatment effective. We have correlations between the genetics and neurology of trans people. Nothing has been refuted.

So you double-down and make more claims without evidence.

[Bill the Cat]

We have correlations between the genetics and neurology of trans people

No you do not.

[Psychic Missile]

So you double-down and make more claims without evidence.

Beyond the fact that my position is shared by doctors and scientists, these are only a sample of the evidence available.

Transitioning is effective
Hormonal therapy and sex reassignment: a systematic review and meta-analysis of quality of life and psychosocial outcomes
Quality of life of individuals with and without facial feminization surgery or gender reassignment surgery.
Prolonged anorexia nervosa associated with female-to-male gender dysphoria: A case report
Psychosocial outcome and quality of sexual life after sex reassignment surgery: An Italian multicentric study
Psychological status as Measured by the MMPI in Japanese Clients with Gender Identity Disorder
Suicide risk in the UK trans population and the role of gender transition in decreasing suicidal ideation and suicide attempt
Young Adult Psychological Outcome After Puberty Suppression and Gender Reassignment
ETC.

Genetic factor
Androgen Receptor Repeat Length Polymorphism Associated with Male-to-Female Transsexualism
A polymorphism of the CYP17 gene related to sex steroid metabolism is associated with female-to-male but not male-to-female transsexualism
How genes result in sexual dimorphism

Neurological Factor
A sex difference in the human brain and its relation to transsexuality
Male-to-Female Transsexuals Have Female Neuron Numbers in a Limbic Nucleus
The biology of human psychosexual differentiation
A sex difference in the hypothalamic uncinate nucleus: relationship to gender identity
Regional gray matter variation in male-to-female transsexualism
White matter microstructure in female to male transsexuals before cross-sex hormonal treatment. A diffusion tensor imaging study
ETC.

[Sparko]

Beyond the fact that my position is shared by doctors and scientists, these are only a sample of the evidence available.

Transitioning is effective
Hormonal therapy and sex reassignment: a systematic review and meta-analysis of quality of life and psychosocial outcomes
Quality of life of individuals with and without facial feminization surgery or gender reassignment surgery.
Prolonged anorexia nervosa associated with female-to-male gender dysphoria: A case report
Psychosocial outcome and quality of sexual life after sex reassignment surgery: An Italian multicentric study
Psychological status as Measured by the MMPI in Japanese Clients with Gender Identity Disorder
Suicide risk in the UK trans population and the role of gender transition in decreasing suicidal ideation and suicide attempt
Young Adult Psychological Outcome After Puberty Suppression and Gender Reassignment
ETC.

Its obvious you didn't even look at these links. Where did you google them from? They don't prove what you claimed. Many are just abstract stubs. The second one is not even about transgendering but about anorexa in those that also are transgender. Well duh. A lot of times mental illness comes in groups.

I am sure the guy who wants to be a chicken will be happier if he is treated like a chicken by society, and even gets his feathers. Does that mean the correct treatment is to turn him into a chicken? No.

Genetic factor
Androgen Receptor Repeat Length Polymorphism Associated with Male-to-Female Transsexualism
A polymorphism of the CYP17 gene related to sex steroid metabolism is associated with female-to-male but not male-to-female transsexualism
How genes result in sexual dimorphism

The one about the androgen receptor? That is one of the RARE genetic defects I already mentioned. The body doesn't respond to testosterone and the male develops female secondary sexual characteristics and reduced male genitalia. It is pretty freaking rare and not something that you see in all cases as you were suggesting.


Your second genetic study:
"The Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders defines transsexualism as the desire to be of the opposite sex or the assertion that one is of the sex opposite from the one assigned at birth (2). It is a rare condition, with incidence rates between 1:12,000 to 1:40,000 (3, 4). The etiology of transsexualism is unknown, but it has been speculated that the influence of sex steroids on early brain development may play an important roleChromosomal aberrations are not found at an increased rate among both male-to-female (MtF) and female-to-male (FtM) transsexuals based on a study in 30 and 31 affected individuals, respectively (8). In a small series of 29 Swedish MtF transsexuals, however, Henningsson et al. (9) observed an association between MtF transsexualism and a CA repeat polymorphism in the estrogen receptor (ER) beta gene.

At this point it is clear you are just trying to flood with argument by weblinks (which isn't allowed) and haven't even bothered to check your own links. Or maybe you just got a list of links from some other page. Either way, you have not proven anything you claimed.

[Jedidiah]

Sparko, I have explained to you multiple times that gender dysphoria is based on abnormal gene expression, which would preclude "species dysphoria". I have asked you again and again to support your claims with evidence, but you keep refusing to do so. How do you know if GD treatment isn't effective? You provide no evidence, you just say it isn't. Why can't abnormal gene expression result in GD? You provide no evidence, you just say it isn't. Trying to get to where your opinions come from is like pulling teeth. I can only conclude that your reasoning is based on "just because", as in "just because it's weird" or "just because I don't like it". If you cannot explain why you have an opinion, you have no business expressing it.

Where is the evidence that gender dysphoria is based on abnormal gene expression and not some emotional reaction like other mental illnesses?

[Jedidiah]

Beyond the fact that my position is shared by doctors and scientists, these are only a sample of the evidence available.

And we all know that Psychiatrists and other doctors are immune to having any agenda that would make it worthwhile to be paid to do useless and harmful surgery.

[JimL]

Identifying as the sex opposite of the reality of their sex is a purely mental problem. We have already eliminated physical causes.

Dysphoria is mental in nature yes, but dysphoria in itself, since in itself it is not the cause of suffering, is not a mental d/o. The cause of the dysphoric's suffering is you.

[Jedidiah]

Dysphoria is mental in nature yes, but dysphoria in itself, since in itself it is not the cause of suffering, is not a mental d/o. The cause of the dysphoric's suffering is you.

Baloney no matter how thin you slice it.

[JonathanL]

More like when your parents didn't tan your backside enough...

The two are not mutually exclusive.

[JimL]

Baloney no matter how thin you slice it.

"Baloney" is not a well thought out rebuttal to my position. Dysphorics, unlike in the case of actual mental d/o's such as schizophrenia or Bi-polar d/o, do not suffer because they are dysphoric, their suffering is caused by the non-acceptance and bullying the recieve from people who don't know any better.The direct cause is external, not internal.

[Jedidiah]

"Baloney" is not a well thought out rebuttal to my position. Dysphorics, unlike in the case of actual mental d/o's such as schizophrenia or Bi-polar d/o, do not suffer because they are dysphoric, their suffering is caused by the non-acceptance and bullying the recieve from people who don't know any better.The direct cause is external, not internal.

https://www.psychiatry.org/patients-...nder-dysphoria

Gender dysphoria involves a conflict between a person's physical or assigned gender and the gender with which he/she/they identify. People with gender dysphoria may be very uncomfortable with the gender they were assigned, sometimes described as being uncomfortable with their body (particularly developments during puberty) or being uncomfortable with the expected roles of their assigned gender.

People with gender dysphoria may often experience significant distress and/or problems functioning associated with this conflict between the way they feel and think of themselves (referred to as experienced or expressed gender) and their physical or assigned gender.

The American Psychiatric Association does not agree with you. While social interaction does add to the discomfort, it is the dysphoria that brings the problem. So it is baloney no matter how thin you slice it.

[One Bad Pig]

"Baloney" is not a well thought out rebuttal to my position.

Your position isn't exactly well thought out to begin with.

[Terraceth]

Dysphoria is mental in nature yes, but dysphoria in itself, since in itself it is not the cause of suffering, is not a mental d/o.

One is left wondering, then, why it is listed as a diagnosis in the "Mental, Behavioral and Neurodevelopmental Disorders" section of the International Classification of Diseases.

[JimL]

https://www.psychiatry.org/patients-...nder-dysphoria

Gender dysphoria involves a conflict between a person's physical or assigned gender and the gender with which he/she/they identify. People with gender dysphoria may be very uncomfortable with the gender they were assigned, sometimes described as being uncomfortable with their body (particularly developments during puberty) or being uncomfortable with the expected roles of their assigned gender.

People with gender dysphoria may often experience significant distress and/or problems functioning associated with this conflict between the way they feel and think of themselves (referred to as experienced or expressed gender) and their physical or assigned gender.

The American Psychiatric Association does not agree with you. While social interaction does add to the discomfort, it is the dysphoria that brings the problem. So it is baloney no matter how thin you slice it.

Thats not a d/o in the brain, its a conflict with ones feelings and their physical nature. There is no structural abnormality or chemical imbalance of the brain itself that is causing the dysphoric to suffer. The discomfort is not because the brain is abnormal any more so than it is because the genitals are abnormal, the discomfort is in the mismatch between the two. Why point to the brain and to the mental nature of the person as the source of the problem rather than to their physical nature when there is no actual abnormality in either the brain or the genitals?

[Bill the Cat]

Thats not a d/o in the brain, its a conflict with ones feelings and their physical nature. There is no structural abnormality or chemical imbalance of the brain itself that is causing the dysphoric to suffer. The discomfort is not because the brain is abnormal any more so than it is because the genitals are abnormal, the discomfort is in the mismatch between the two. Why point to the brain and to the mental nature of the person as the source of the problem rather than to their physical nature when there is no actual abnormality in either the brain or the genitals?

You're still arguing as if there are such things as "male" and "female" brains. There are not!