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Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s
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Originally posted by Cerebrum123 View PostNot really surprising to me.Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s
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Originally posted by seer View PostKiwimac is a Catholic priest? I find that hard to believe...
Originally posted by demi-conservative View PostThe first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.
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Originally posted by seer View PostKiwimac is a Catholic priest? I find that hard to believe...1Cor 15:34 Come to your senses as you ought and stop sinning; for I say to your shame, there are some who know not God.
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Scripture before Tradition:
but that won't prevent others from
taking it upon themselves to deprive you
of the right to call yourself Christian.
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Originally posted by Cow Poke View PostClaims to be....I DENOUNCE DONALD J. TRUMP AND ALL HIS IMMORAL ACTS.
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Originally posted by seer View PostI don't know, most of the Priests I have know over the years were fiercely pro-life...Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio
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I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist
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Originally posted by Sparko View PostI thought Kiwimac was Anglican for some reason.1Cor 15:34 Come to your senses as you ought and stop sinning; for I say to your shame, there are some who know not God.
.⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛
Scripture before Tradition:
but that won't prevent others from
taking it upon themselves to deprive you
of the right to call yourself Christian.
⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛
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Originally posted by Sparko View PostI thought Kiwimac was Anglican for some reason.Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio
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I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist
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Originally posted by One Bad Pig View PostThe Old Catholics are in communion with the Anglicans; he may have moved from one to the other.
Say it isn't so, Ethel.
ETA
it is soLast edited by tabibito; 01-09-2018, 10:19 AM.1Cor 15:34 Come to your senses as you ought and stop sinning; for I say to your shame, there are some who know not God.
.⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛
Scripture before Tradition:
but that won't prevent others from
taking it upon themselves to deprive you
of the right to call yourself Christian.
⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛
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Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio
sigpic
I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist
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Originally posted by kiwimac View PostThe argument here is that, in Christian theology, ensoulement takes place at conception; this is a position based almost entirely on Greek philosophy and was largely formulated by St. Augustine of Hippo. It has no counterpart in Hebrew theology and certainly not in the OT, In Hebrew thought ensoulment takes place at first breath, as it did for Adam and Eve, not at conception. The Bible reflects the former POV not the latter.
To summarize the Jewish Alexandrian perspective, they (as well as Palestinian Jews) saw a distinction between a partially and fully formed fetus (fully formed starting probably on the 40th day). In his reading of the Septuagint of Exodus 21:22-25 that reads "harm" as "form", Philo points out that from a legal perspective, abortion was penalized in different ways depending on whether the fetus was partially or fully formed,
If a man comes to blows with a pregnant woman and strikes her on the belly and she miscarries, then, if the result of the miscarriage is unshaped and undeveloped, he must be fined both for the outrage and for obstructing the artist Nature in her creative work of bringing into life the fairest of living creatures, man. But, if the offspring is already shaped and all the limbs have their proper qualities and places in the system, he must die, for that which answers to this description is a human being, which he has destroyed in the laboratory of Nature who judges that the hour has not yet come for bringing it out into the light, like a statue lying in a studio requiring nothing more than to be conveyed outside and released from confinement.
In Palestine, most of our material on the subject comes from Mishnah, the Talmud and Josephus.
Concerning ensoulment, it's not nearly as clear cut as you imagine,
Gorman goes on to point out that the matter of accidental miscarriage/abortion was mostly a legal and cultic matter for Palestinian Jews, and had more to do with rules on uncleanness. As an example, a child that was delivered by way of Caesarean was not considered a valid birth, and so would not make the woman's house unclean since it "did not pass through the area where birth took place."
Also in Palestine, the view that the fetus was a human life was divided between a majority, and vocal minority view. Unlike Philo's reading of Exodus 21, that read "harm" as "form", Josephus (representing the majority Palestinian rabbinical view) reads Exodus 21 as an accidental miscarriage that resulted in the death of a woman, and the "life for a life" was applied to the mother's death, not the child. So, unlike Alexandria, the majority Palestinian view was that the unborn child did not have the same legal status as a person, and was considered, to some extent, a part of the mother. From a legal point of view, if the unborn child caused the mother major health complications, the child could be aborted to save the mother.
The minority Palestinian view was that the fetus had both a measure of personal and legal rights, and the dead, unborn fetus was considered a truly dead person. This view was based on a particular reading of Genesis 9:6,
Whoso sheddeth the blood of man within [another] man, shall his blood be shed.
TL;DR? To summarize the views, Gorman writes,
And on that matter, we have very early (as early as the 1st century) attestation from Christians that they were against abortion.Last edited by Adrift; 01-09-2018, 11:15 AM.
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Originally posted by Tassman View PostYou mean that they're not your sort of Christian. But they are the majority of people who claim to be Christian and their views carry as much weight as yours.Micah 6:8 He has told you, O man, what is good; and what does the LORD require of you but to do justice, and to love kindness, and to walk humbly with your God?
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