Is the Earth Flat? - Some Evidence Presented

[JohnMartin]

The Rutan flight headed east->west.

Can you figure out why?

A Helio would say because of the W-E rotation of the earth. A Geo would say because of the E-W rotation of the local aether flow.

JM

[klaus54]

A gravity vector will not curve water. That's why we see long flat lakes and wide flat bays of water. Try again.

Local flatness as a maths concept has to account for curvature of the earth and the curved water surface.

JM

It's not "curving" water. Do understand vectors? The gravity vector acts pointwise. The ocean's surface at any point (when not disturbed by wind or seismic waves!) is ALWAYS perpendicular to the pointwise gravity vector.

[HMS_Beagle]

The natural state of water at the earth's surface is to form a flat surface. Try a lake for example. Your example means the oceans are without a gravity field.

Sorry trollbat but a perfectly smooth lake isn't flat. It has the same tiny amount of curvature that the entire earth's surface does. It's just not generally noticeable to human perception and tends to get swamped in the "noise" wind and wave action.

Here's a case where the Earth's curvature could be detected on a real 24-mile long lake.

How to Estimate the Radius of the Earth With a Lake

Troll better next time.

[klaus54]

A Helio would say because of the W-E rotation of the earth. A Geo would say because of the E-W rotation of the local aether flow.

JM

Then how's come the prevailing winds at mid-latitudes are W->E?

The Rutan took off from Kaliforny.

Is the AF(tm) too weak to move air?

[HMS_Beagle]

A Helio would say because of the W-E rotation of the earth. A Geo would say because of the E-W rotation of the local aether flow.

JM

Q. What does a Geo say when asked why don't geostationary satellites fall straight down to the ground?

A. OOOOHH NOOO! Hand me the Charmin, I've soiled myself again!

[Juvenal]

It's a metal.

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That's just what I'd expect a reptilian to say.

[psstein]

No, the Earth is not flat.

This was shown long before a workable heliocentric theory developed.

[JohnMartin]

It's not "curving" water. Do understand vectors? The gravity vector acts pointwise. The ocean's surface at any point (when not disturbed by wind or seismic waves!) is ALWAYS perpendicular to the pointwise gravity vector.

The gravity vector will not curve water. We see this by noting the large distances we observe over water. Such as lochs (41km) in Scotland and very wide bays and observing Chicago from the far side of Lake Michigan. The land on both sides of these bodies of water shows the water is flat. This means the gravity vector which apparently changes orientation the further away from the viewer, and causes the water to curve is not observed to cause water to curve.

Apparently the imaginary gravity vector on a globe doesn't produce the curvature results on observed bodies of water.

JM

[JohnMartin]

No, the Earth is not flat.

This was shown long before a workable heliocentric theory developed.

How so?

JM

[JohnMartin]

Q. What does a Geo say when asked why don't geostationary satellites fall straight down to the ground?

A. OOOOHH NOOO! Hand me the Charmin, I've soiled myself again!

What does the Helio do when he is told to deny the Geo model and prefer the Helio model invalidates relativity's claim of no preferred reference frame?

What does the Helio do when he is shown how the Helio model does not account for satellites with an earth elliptical orbit?

What does the Helio do when he is shown the Geo model does account for GPS?

Denial.


JM

[JohnMartin]

Apparently a superior mirage is required to account for seeing Chicago from the far side of Lake Michigan. The distance involved to see Chicago at 59 miles away is 2320 ft, or 707 m.

See the video from about time 18:00 mins.

If the superior mirage exists, the light seen from the far side of Lake Michigan elevates the based of the Chicago buildings by 707m. 707m is over twice as high as the statue of Liberty which stands at 305m high. So to maintain the curved earth Chicago light must be elevated by about 700m to be viewed from the far side of Lake Michigan.

Does this sound realistic?


I currently believe such a situation is unrealistic, but I am open to seeing the science behind the so called superior mirage.

JM

[JohnMartin]

Sorry trollbat but a perfectly smooth lake isn't flat. It has the same tiny amount of curvature that the entire earth's surface does. It's just not generally noticeable to human perception and tends to get swamped in the "noise" wind and wave action.

Here's a case where the Earth's curvature could be detected on a real 24-mile long lake.

How to Estimate the Radius of the Earth With a Lake

Troll better next time.

The information is inadequate. Apparently a superior mirage exists when Chicago is seen from the far side of Lake Michigan, but when these calcs are done, not a mention of refraction or of mirages. Its another example only seeing what you want to see. Also we have no way of knowing if the camera was level or tilted. Apparently mirages exist only when the curvature is in doubt. Also we really don't know what we are looking at because the camera show doesn't show us how for down the Bascule bridge is seen from the shore.

The article also claims the Greeks worked out the curvature of the earth. This claim is also fallacious as the experiment could assume any shaped earth between the measured shadows.

JM

[JohnMartin]

Then how's come the prevailing winds at mid-latitudes are W->E?

The Rutan took off from Kaliforny.

Is the AF(tm) too weak to move air?

That's the direction of the aether flow from W->E. The prevailing wind direction is opposite to what the Helio model would predict. The Helio mode says the earth rotates W->E, which infers the atmosphere will predominantly move opposite to the rotating earth at E->W. The planes flight is better explained by a Geo model.

JM

[JohnMartin]

The point is, Troll, that in the absence of (net) gravity, surface tension is the only force (except for the astronaut's breath.)

Earth's gravity field (when the frame is not in free fall!) near the surface far overwhelms surface tension.

Anywho, the ocean surface behaves exactly how one would expect on a spherical Earth, where a (still water) surface is perpendicular to the gravity vector at that point.

Exactly? Are you sure? Can you prove it? I would like to see that.

JM

[Roy]

Apparently horizontal vision is restricted by several factors such as the atmosphere and perspective. Some FEer's think we can only ever see so far, analogous to only hearing so far.

None of these would explain how the top of a landmark or ship can be seen from sea when the base of it is still below the horizon.