Originally posted by Bill the Cat
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If Indiana Jones happened to be a member of Tweb, this is where he'd hang out.
Welcome to the Archeology forum. Were you out doing some gardening and dug up a relic from the distant past? would you like to know more about Ancient Egypt? Did you think Memphis was actually a city in Tennessee?
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Welcome to the Archeology forum. Were you out doing some gardening and dug up a relic from the distant past? would you like to know more about Ancient Egypt? Did you think Memphis was actually a city in Tennessee?
Well, for the answers to those and other burning questions you've found the right digs.
Our forum rules apply here too, if you haven't read them now is the time.
Forum Rules: Here
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Camels in Genesis
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Originally posted by Outis View PostNot my opinion. That's the mainstream scholarly consensus. The arguments that I can evaluate are sound, and the evidence, in sum, agrees.
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Originally posted by Kbertsche View PostBut the issue is not a slam-dunk. There are also scholarly arguments for a much earlier composition of the Pentateuch, and a number of conservative scholars who hold this position.
I would like to here more the 'recent' scholarly arguments.
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Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post'a number of conservative scholars?'
I would like to here more the 'recent' scholarly arguments.
http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/sh...g-of-the-Torah-The universe begins to look more like a great thought than a great machine.
Sir James Jeans
-This most beautiful system (The Universe) could only proceed from the dominion of an intelligent and powerful Being.All variety of created objects which represent order and Life in the Universe could happen only by the willful reasoning of its original Creator, whom I call the Lord God.
Sir Isaac Newton
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Originally posted by Quantum Weirdness View PostYou all might want to debate this over here to avoid derailing the thread.
http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/sh...g-of-the-Torah
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Originally posted by shunyadragon View PostI have been on this thread, and I may respond more, but as it ended I did not see anything that reflected physical nor linguistic evidence. The conservative scholars rely on internal scripture arguments and tradition to justify earlier dates, and I find this inadequate.
How much physical evidence would you expect (especially if orality was valued over written word)?
The linguistic evidence isn't exactly much and the text we have now could have been a transliteration.
Here BTW is Glenn Miller's argument for a pre-exilic date.
http://www.christianthinktank.com/qmoses1.html-The universe begins to look more like a great thought than a great machine.
Sir James Jeans
-This most beautiful system (The Universe) could only proceed from the dominion of an intelligent and powerful Being.All variety of created objects which represent order and Life in the Universe could happen only by the willful reasoning of its original Creator, whom I call the Lord God.
Sir Isaac Newton
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Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post'a number of conservative scholars?'
I would like to here more the 'recent' scholarly arguments.
As someone else suggested, this issue is probably best discussed in the JEDP thread so as not to derail the discussion of camels. Most theological conservatives reject the documentary hypothesis (JEDP), though some who accept it would still call themselves theologically conservative (I suspect Peter Enns might fall into this category).
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Originally posted by Kbertsche View PostAlso, don't ignore or overlook the paper that I recommended on page 2:
http://moodle.tau.ac.il/pluginfile.p...tion%20ANE.pdf
I don't know who wrote it, but it is well footnoted and seems to have a good bibliography.
http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/...tic-camel.html
I had coincidentally just received a copy of Martin Heide's paper from a mutual friend:
"The Domestication of the Camel: Biological, Archaeological and Inscriptional Evidence from Mesopotamia, Egypt, Israel and Arabia, and Literary Evidence from the Hebrew Bible" -- Martin Heide, Marburg
http://www.academia.edu/2065314/_The...g_2011_331-384
Here are the first two paragraphs of his "tentative conclusion":
In other words, the literary evidence from Genesis seems to be consistent with archaeological evidence from the ancient near east.
(Question: where did the "cite" tag go, or what was it replaced by?)
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Originally posted by Quantum Weirdness View PostOne comment here
How much physical evidence would you expect (especially if orality was valued over written word)?
The linguistic evidence isn't exactly much and the text we have now could have been a transliteration.
Here BTW is Glenn Miller's argument for a pre-exilic date.
http://www.christianthinktank.com/qmoses1.html
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Originally posted by Outis View PostTo those to whom literalism is an a priori belief, no evidence would be a "slam dunk." When one takes an a priori position, evidence is subservient to belief.
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Originally posted by Kbertsche View PostPerhaps. But the same argument could be made of those who take an a priori position of atheistic naturalism (i.e. God does not exist, God did not inspire any holy books.) Evidence for God is subservient to their atheistic commitment. The argument applies both ways.
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Originally posted by Outis View PostNow, one potentially huge problem with the article: while this is the earliest they have discovered, what happens if there are more skeletons out there that have not been discovered? This is the biggest pitfall of such claims.
Blessings,
Lee"What I pray of you is, to keep your eye upon Him, for that is everything. Do you say, 'How am I to keep my eye on Him?' I reply, keep your eye off everything else, and you will soon see Him. All depends on the eye of faith being kept on Him. How simple it is!" (J.B. Stoney)
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