Is ASCII Code relevant for Apocalypse 13:18? I think so

[hansgeorg]

I'm an IT professional - I KNOW what ASCII is - and you're showing your ignorance by calling it the "ASCII code", because that translates to the American Standard Code for Information Interchange code. That's redundant.

What, exactly, do you expect to find by forcing ASCII onto Scripture?

ASCII "Code" is redundant, ok. But still actually used, since one speaks of other "codes" (Morse and some more).

Forcing it onto Scripture? I don't see any forcing being done. If St John on Patmos received a genuine prophecy, it can have involved for him genuine foreknowledge of ASCII.

It is for instance telling that he and his disciples were not being precise about it being "Greek gematria" or "Hebrew gematria", which could have happened if he had been talking just from things commonly known back then.

[hansgeorg]

Austria and Russia weren't pagan in 1918.
They were Christian societies, ya doofus.

Problem is, the Church Fathers didn't say "after Pagan Rome". They said "after Rome".

And Austria and Russia were representing Christian Rome up to WW-I.

[Sparko]

Problem is, the Church Fathers didn't say "after Pagan Rome". They said "after Rome".

And Austria and Russia were representing Christian Rome up to WW-I.

Why do you think that? Because it fits your ideas, so it must be so?

[hansgeorg]

Can you please numerologize doofus so he grasps the concept?

d 68 060 8
o 79 130 17
o 79 200 26
f 70 270 26
u 85 350 31
s 83 430 34 464

464
192
656

Not too bad!

[rogue06]

I'm an IT professional - I KNOW what ASCII is - and you're showing your ignorance by calling it the "ASCII code", because that translates to the American Standard Code for Information Interchange code. That's redundant.

What, exactly, do you expect to find by forcing ASCII onto Scripture?

Want to bet he also says ATM machine (Automatic Teller Machine machine)?

[rogue06]

Problem is, the Church Fathers didn't say "after Pagan Rome". They said "after Rome".

And Austria and Russia were representing Christian Rome up to WW-I.

Um, Russia is Eastern Orthodox.

[rogue06]

Yes, an expert on redundancy!

An expert specialist on repetitive redundancy

[Sparko]

Want to bet he also says ATM machine (Automatic Teller Machine machine)?

The ones you have to use a PIN number on?

[hansgeorg]

Why do you think that? Because it fits your ideas, so it must be so?

Why I think the Church Fathers were not saying "Pagan Rome"?

Look at the quotes!

Austria and Russia representing Christian Rome?

Rome was divided into West and East.

Western power was legitimately accepted by Franks, who in 800 received the Imperial dignity from the Pope, because the Eastern "Emperor" Irene (Empress was only said of Queens consort, not of ruling ones in Byzantium) was acting as a Barbarian (even if she was a saint) in sentencing her son to be blinded, because he was an iconoclast.

Charlemagne's Empire was divided, Imperial dignity went East within the West, that is to the part called among other things Germany, known as Holy Roman Empire of Germanic Nation. This retained the Christian Roman dignity up to 1806, and in successor states, Imperial dignity went to Austria which retained it to 1918.

East was temporarily down (from W pov) under Irene, temporarily under Latin rule, but more or less functioning to 1453. After that its role was assumed by the former Grand Dukes, now Czars of Russia. Up to "october" (Julian calendar!) 1917.

So, Christian Rome lasted till 1918 or 1917 or both years, whichever of Austria and Russia best fits the role of a Christian Rome.

[rogue06]

The ones you have to use a PIN number on?

Egg-zactamundo

[hansgeorg]

Um, Russia is Eastern Orthodox.

You mean was. When it was so, abortion was really a nono.

Now Putin and Kirill claim it is impossible to totally ban abortion in Russia.

[hansgeorg]

Why I think the Church Fathers were not saying "Pagan Rome"?

Look at the quotes!

St. Augustine of Hippo (345 - 430) Doctor of the Church
City of God, Book XX, Chapter 19

For what does he [Paul] mean by "For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now holdeth, let him hold until he be taken out of the way: and then shall the wicked be revealed?" [2 Thess 2] I frankly confess I do not know what he means. ... However, it is not absurd to believe that these words of the apostle, "Only he who now holdeth, let him hold until he be taken out of the way," refer to the Roman empire, as if it were said, "Only he who now reigneth, let him reign until he be taken out of the way." "And then shall the wicked be revealed:" no one doubts that this means Antichrist.

Source: http://newadvent.org/fathers/120120.htm

_____________________________________

The testimony is clear, the early church fathers quoted above generally expected the Antichrist to rise to power very soon after the fall of pagan Rome as prophesied in the book of Daniel, chapter 7. At the time that Paul wrote to the church at Thessalonica, the Caesars ruled, and until they were removed they restrained the Antichrist from rising to prominence and exercising his power. This is why Paul could not speak openly about the restrainer in his letter, because he did not want to invite unnecessary persecution by identifying Rome openly and predicting its demise. Pagan Rome's rule ended in 476 A.D., so the above fathers were writing, in some cases, hundreds of years before the event, demonstrating that they understood prophecy, at least on that point.

_____________________________________

Note that St Augustine says nothing of Rome being "pagan", in his time the Caesars were Catholics (some would say Orthodox), as he was.

Note also, when the Czar was taken away, Lenin took his place. When the Austrian Emperor was taken away from Hungary (where he was King), Bela Kun took a place which in years coincides very well with the Antichrist verses of Apocalypse 19.

Note also, in post-Czarist Russia, Vladimir Lenin was the first Vladimir, or Vladimir A, Vladimir Putin is the second Vladimir, or Vladimir B.

And check out VLADIMIRB, now.

[JonathanL]

I can't believe a serious discussion is being had over ASCII - American Standard Code for Information Interchange - numbers to understand Hebrew and Greek.

I think hansgeorg is the only one who's taking this discussion seriously.

[JonathanL]

Your full name is not Johann? Hans is short for Johann

It's also it's own proper name.

[Cow Poke]

I think hansgeorg is the only one who's taking this discussion seriously.

I should hope so.