Comment Thread for The Resurrection of Jesus - Apologiaphoenix vs Gary

[psstein]

No, anti-supernaturalism.

In thirty years, your belief in bodily reanimations will be a thing of history. Only a few backwoods, uneducated hillbillies will believe it. It is silly and ignorant. Abandon it now before your grandchildren are forced to read more of your superstitious nonsense scattered on the world wide web.

Drink! The same thing was said in the 1960s.

There are more religious believers now than ever before.

[psstein]

No. I want to show that it is a collection of writings by men, not of an all-knowing benevolent God. An all-knowing, benevolent God would send a very simple message of eternal salvation that even a child could understand. He would make sure that every human being on the face of the earth knew exactly what his Word meant. Instead, the Christian holy book has been the source of division, arguments, wars, and massive suffering for two thousand years.

As is to be expected, you're evading the point and changing the subject.

Being ignorant or outright stupid is easy; you don't have to do anything. Being informed is very tough.

[Gary]

No, Nick's use of "anti-intellectualism" to describe your mindset is quite accurate.
Yeah, Voltaire thought that too, three centuries ago.

Voltaire didn't have the Internet. :)

[Gary]

Drink! The same thing was said in the 1960s.

There are more religious believers now than ever before.

Not in educated western societies. In the United States the percentage of people describing themselves as non-religious is now over 20%. It is true that religion is growing in Asia and Africa. But I believe that once the Internet fully penetrates those areas of the world and once those areas reach a level of education comparable to the West, religion will decline there as well.

All one has to do is look at the continual decline in membership numbers, worship attendance numbers, and especially baptism numbers in all the major Christian denominations in the West to see the Church's rapid decline.

[Gary]

As is to be expected, you're evading the point and changing the subject.

Being ignorant or outright stupid is easy; you don't have to do anything. Being informed is very tough.

If you want to be informed on ancient Greek mythology, you need to study it. And to consider yourself an authority on the subject, you need to learn the language and be a scholar on the subject. However, you don't need to read even one sentence, of even one Greek mythology scholar, to know that Greek mythology is not real. Furthermore, you do not need to read one sentence of one book by a Greek mythology scholar to know that Zeus is non-existent and there is no need to fear eternal punishment from Zeus if you refuse to believe in him.

If you want to be an expert in the beliefs of ancient Christians, by all means, be a NT scholar and you will have my respect. But tell me that because you are a scholar in the beliefs of ancient Christians that you are an authority in the reality and historicity of ancient Christian dead body reanimations, and I will laugh in your face.

[tabibito]

The problem for Gary seems to be that he can't tell when the claims he makes about the actual record of scripture is accurate. His wildly inaccurate claims about what the scriptures actually record leaves him with little option but to make supercilious accusations.

[One Bad Pig]

Voltaire didn't have the Internet. :)

You're no Voltaire - and neither is the typical internet atheist. Besides, access to the internet has enhanced, not degraded, my faith.

[Gary]

I just published this post on my blog, along with a big picture of Zeus:

Conservative Christians often get very angry and exasperated with me when I challenge the scholarship of conservative Christian New Testament scholars such as William Lane Craig, NT Wright, Mike Licona, Peter Kreeft, et al., regarding their claim of the reality and historicity of the bodily resurrection of Jesus. I am told that before I am qualified to challenge and criticize the positions of these scholars, I need to learn the ancient languages and do an in depth study of the scholarly literature (ie. become a scholar myself).

Here is my reply:

If you want to be informed on ancient Greek mythology, you need to study it. And to consider yourself an authority on ancient Greek mythology, you need to learn the language and be a credentialed scholar on the subject.

However, you don't need to read even one sentence, of even one Greek mythology scholar's books, to know that Greek mythology is not real. Furthermore, you do not need to read one sentence of one book by a Greek mythology scholar to know that Zeus is non-existent and that there is no need to fear eternal punishment from Zeus for refusing to believe in him and refusing to obey the teachings of the ancient Greek religion.

If you want to be an expert in the beliefs of ancient Christians, by all means, be a NT scholar and you will have my respect. But tell me that because you are a scholar in the beliefs of ancient Christians that you are somehow an authority in the reality and historicity of ancient dead body reanimations/resurrections, and I will laugh in your face.

[Gary]

The problem for Gary seems to be that he can't tell when the claims he makes about the actual record of scripture is accurate. His wildly inaccurate claims about what the scriptures actually record leaves him with little option but to make supercilious accusations.

"Supercilious"

I love it. Let me write that one down to use on my blog!

[Christianbookworm]

Nope. We just get mildly annoyed and amused. And Zeus is the kind of character that would make it really obvious if he existed.

[Gary]

You're no Voltaire - and neither is the typical internet atheist. Besides, access to the internet has enhanced, not degraded, my faith.

And you're no John Kennedy...

I just had to say that.

Anyway, the internet may have strengthened your faith, but it is a major factor in the decline of Christianity in educated, western civilization. I will post a link to an article on it.

http://www.technologyreview.com/view...icas-religion/

[Christianbookworm]

Sure, believe every dumb thing on the internet. Opinions are facts!

[tabibito]

I don't think anyone told Gary that he had to become proficient at understanding Koine Greek to make his arguments (perhaps I missed it), but the exercise of the reading comprehension capacity in English of a mentally competent 10 year old would have given him the opportunity to avoid 80% of his posts making him a by-word.

[Gary]

I don't think anyone told Gary that he had to become proficient at understanding Koine Greek to make his arguments (perhaps I missed it), but the exercise of the reading comprehension capacity in English of a mentally competent 10 year old would have given him the opportunity to avoid 80% of his posts making him a by-word.

You silly sesquipedalian, you!

[Gary]

Sure, believe every dumb thing on the internet. Opinions are facts!

In October of 2012 the Pew Research Center announced that for the first time ever Protestant Christians had fallen below 50 percent of the American population. the internet.

http://www.salon.com/2013/01/16/reli..._the_internet/