What the gospel truly says of salvation....

[Cow Poke]

Welcome to Unorthodox Theology, FEB... you can be as weird as you like.

[FarEastBird]

Our gospel does not work, but reveals the work of Jesus Christ. It needs no revision, but it does have to be believed (trusted).

Why would anyone believe your gospel that does not work?

If I will believe it will not work, then it will work?

[Cow Poke]

What "generation"?

Yours. Ya gonna threaten me again?

[FarEastBird]

A wicked and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall no sign be given unto it, but the sign of the prophet Jonas. And he left them, and departed.

That's in the Bible. (hint: in some versions, it's in red letters! )

What "generation"?

[Bill the Cat]

Not merely verses but prophecies. Mainly of the prophesies regarding the blindness of the Jews, for which salvation will come to the Gentiles, and to provoke the Jews to jealousy.

That was fulfilled with Christ's ministry. Their ultimate apostasy was them rejecting their savior.

It includes the limited reign of the apostles and disciples unto a thousand years(though not literally a thousand) Rev 20:6.

Sorry, no. The "thousand years" is preceded by the resurrection of the just.

It includes the prophesied overcoming of the beast over the saints(Dan 7:21, Rev 13:7, 11:7)). And, also of Amos 8:11-13. Note also of Paul's warning regarding the decay of the Church; warning them with "tears" (Acts 20:29-31).

These are not verses on apostasy. Especially Dan 7:21 which is nothing more than a greeting to Nebuchadnezzar.

Christ built the Church among the apostles who are Jews, and that the Jews and Gentiles that believed were under Peter's foundation (Matt 16:18, Act 15:7).

No. They were under the foundation of the confession of faith, just like Peter made.

The authority of priesthood was still among the Jews,

Until the veil was rent and the Old system was superseded by the new and everlasting Priesthood of Christ after the order of Melchizedek. See the Book of Hebrews for why Jesus qualified to be their eternal Priest and King.

that is why the apostles were preaching unto the Jews "first" (Acts 14:46, 28:20).

It was because of the promises made to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob.

Seeing the Church is built among the Jews, it was therefore subject unto apostasy together with the apostles and disciples.

Utterly false. Apostasy is following after "the man of sin", and the early Jewish believers did no such thing. Their worst offense was to try to make an amalgam of the 2 covenants. Nowhere were they condemned for apostasy for that.

Thus, Peter spoke of "putting off" his tabernacle (2Pet 2:13).

2 Peter 2:13 suffering wrong as the wage for their wrongdoing. They count it pleasure to revel in the daytime. They are blots and blemishes, reveling in their deceptions, while they feast with you.

No he didn't. Paul said in Colossians 2:11:

In whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ:

But that's the closest thing to what you are claiming.

And because of the apostasy of the Church,

There was no apostasy of the Church. Paul links the apostasia with the revealing of the Man of Sin

2 Thessalonians 2:3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

that the disciples spoke of Gentile elect of God that will believe in the future (Acts 15:14-18, 28:29).

When the Gentiles would be GRAFTED IN to the existing vine along with the NATURAL branches. The natural branches would still be connected as long as they to believed, which they did.

Christ himself spoke of calling other believers that were not part of the fold of the apostles and disciples (John 10:16).

That had absolutely nothing to do with a supposed "Jewish church apostasy".

So, understand that I did not take it from just a verse.

And those that you claimed do not speak of what you claim.

[Jedidiah]

So, "your' gospel did not work, and needed some revisions?

Our gospel does not work, but reveals the work of Jesus Christ. It needs no revision, but it does have to be believed (trusted).

[Cow Poke]

I got the Spirit.

Unfortunately, I don't think the Spirit has you.

[Cow Poke]

I searched myself, not just by reading, but asked God of signs. You should ask God of signs for yourself.

A wicked and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall no sign be given unto it, but the sign of the prophet Jonas. And he left them, and departed.

That's in the Bible. (hint: in some versions, it's in red letters! )

[FarEastBird]

Where'd you get the idea that the Church would apostasize? Israel =/= Church

When Christ came, salvation still belongs to the Jews (John 4:22). Note also what Jesus said to the Canaanite woman (Matt 15:26-27). The apostles cannot pass authority of priesthood unto the Gentiles when the Jews do not reject the gospel; this is the reason why the apostles preached to the Jews first. It was needed for the Jews to fall so that salvation would come to the Gentiles. This is a mystery that is a part of the gospel. Without understanding this mystery, you will not be able to comprehend in fullness the mystery of the gospel.

[FarEastBird]

They follow a different Christ. Or tack on extra stuff. Or claim that their group is the only saved group. Sounds familiar. Might want to get a mirror. I'm just against your interpretation that a minor issue is a major eternity threatening issue.

So, "your' gospel did not work, and needed some revisions?

[FarEastBird]

Why? You've got the super decoder ring.

I got the Spirit.

John 16:13
13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak:and he will shew you things to come.


See what is stated above as a sign of having the Spirit.......

[Christianbookworm]

If you are against things that are prophesied, then you are God's enemies.

Also, even some cults have accepted "your" gospel, were they saved?

They follow a different Christ. Or tack on extra stuff. Or claim that their group is the only saved group. Sounds familiar. Might want to get a mirror. I'm just against your interpretation that a minor issue is a major eternity threatening issue.

[Christianbookworm]

Not merely verses but prophecies. Mainly of the prophesies regarding the blindness of the Jews, for which salvation will come to the Gentiles, and to provoke the Jews to jealousy. It includes the limited reign of the apostles and disciples unto a thousand years(though not literally a thousand) Rev 20:6. It includes the prophesied overcoming of the beast over the saints(Dan 7:21, Rev 13:7, 11:7)). And, also of Amos 8:11-13. Note also of Paul's warning regarding the decay of the Church; warning them with "tears" (Acts 20:29-31).

Christ built the Church among the apostles who are Jews, and that the Jews and Gentiles that believed were under Peter's foundation (Matt 16:18, Act 15:7). The authority of priesthood was still among the Jews, that is why the apostles were preaching unto the Jews "first" (Acts 14:46, 28:20). Seeing the Church is built among the Jews, it was therefore subject unto apostasy together with the apostles and disciples. Thus, Peter spoke of "putting off" his tabernacle (2Pet 2:13). And because of the apostasy of the Church, that the disciples spoke of Gentile elect of God that will believe in the future (Acts 15:14-18, 28:29). Christ himself spoke of calling other believers that were not part of the fold of the apostles and disciples (John 10:16).



So, understand that I did not took it from just a verse.

Where'd you get the idea that the Church would apostasize? Israel =/= Church

[FarEastBird]

That's why we don't have to know some secret code in the prophecies to be saved. Jesus did all the work for salvation. We just accept that and as a result of being saved, we do good works. Not to earn salvation, but out of gratitude for what Christ did for us.

If you are against things that are prophesied, then you are God's enemies.

Also, even some cults have accepted "your" gospel, were they saved?

[FarEastBird]

What verse do you base this claim on?

Not merely verses but prophecies. Mainly of the prophesies regarding the blindness of the Jews, for which salvation will come to the Gentiles, and to provoke the Jews to jealousy. It includes the limited reign of the apostles and disciples unto a thousand years(though not literally a thousand) Rev 20:6. It includes the prophesied overcoming of the beast over the saints(Dan 7:21, Rev 13:7, 11:7)). And, also of Amos 8:11-13. Note also of Paul's warning regarding the decay of the Church; warning them with "tears" (Acts 20:29-31).

Christ built the Church among the apostles who are Jews, and that the Jews and Gentiles that believed were under Peter's foundation (Matt 16:18, Act 15:7). The authority of priesthood was still among the Jews, that is why the apostles were preaching unto the Jews "first" (Acts 14:46, 28:20). Seeing the Church is built among the Jews, it was therefore subject unto apostasy together with the apostles and disciples. Thus, Peter spoke of "putting off" his tabernacle (2Pet 2:13). And because of the apostasy of the Church, that the disciples spoke of Gentile elect of God that will believe in the future (Acts 15:14-18, 28:29). Christ himself spoke of calling other believers that were not part of the fold of the apostles and disciples (John 10:16).



So, understand that I did not take it from just a verse.