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"Falling Away" and the Gentiles

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  • "Falling Away" and the Gentiles

    One crucial things about prophecy, though often ignored, is the consequence of the "falling away." On my part, understanding the consequence gave me a better picture of what is to come.

    I believe that the falling away is total, and the lost of the word of God amongst the people is total. This is the reason why Christ warned:


    The days will come, when ye shall desire to see one of the days of the Son of man, and ye shall not see it. And they shall say to you, See here; or, see there: go not after them, nor follow them.(Luke 17:22-23)

    I believe that it was this lost of the vision of Christ that Christ himself said, "And then if any man shall say to you, Lo, here is Christ; or, lo, he is there; believe him not:" (Mark 13:21) Such blindness is total that we ought not believe "any" man.

    The prophesy in Amos 8:11-12 is surely related to it, saying:


    11 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord GOD, that I will send a famine in the land, not a famine of bread, nor a thirst for water, but of hearing the words of the LORD: 12 And they shall wander from sea to sea, and from the north even to the east, they shall run to and fro to seek the word of the LORD,and shall not find it.

    From this issue of blindness that would come, it give sense why Christ spoke of calling "other fold" that is not part to the apostles and disciples (John 10:16). There was a cut off of the believers's knowledge of Christ. The first fold had been part of the blindness. While, on the other hand, Isaiah prophesied, "The Lord GOD which gathereth the outcasts of Israel saith, Yet will I gather others to him, beside those that are gathered unto him (Isa 56:8). Isaiah gives us a good reason why Jesus spoke of other fold: God will gather others besides those that are gathered unto Christ.

    But who are these whom God will gather?

    Paul was clearly spoke about how God will make Israel jealous with a gentile nation (Romans 10:19-21) Obviously, this prophesy has yet to be fulfilled before their time; for, as Paul was saying, salvation only comes to the Jews when the Jews had fallen(Rom 11:11).

    Even Christ himself was clear on this, saying to the Jews, "The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof" (Matt 21:43).

    And this is what James said at the council at Jerusalem:

    Acts 15:14-17
    14 Simeon hath declared how God at the first did visit the Gentiles, to take out of them a people for his name. 15 And to this agree the words of the prophets; as it is written, 16 After this I will return, and will build again the tabernacle of David, which is fallen down; and I will build again the ruins thereof, and I will set it up: 17 That the residue of men might seek after the Lord, and all the Gentiles, upon whom my name is called, saith the Lord, who doeth all these things.



    James is quite clear about God calling gentile people in the future. It is quite noting that he was not speaking about Jews here. The reason is, as Paul noted in Isaiah 65:1-2, that when the Gentiles accepted God, yet God was still stretching his hand unto the rebellious Israel, (israel was then still rebellious). On the other hand, not(e) also that the tabernacle of David was fallen, and seem to imply that these gentile people will be from whom God will raise the tabernacle of David. Isaiah also prophesied of this:

    Isa 60:10
    10 And the sons of strangers shall build up thy walls, and their kings shall minister unto thee: for in my wrath I smote thee, but in my favour have I had mercy on thee.


    Obviously, the above prophesy speaks of a time after Israel had fallen away!
    Last edited by FarEastBird; 09-11-2014, 09:26 PM.
    ...WISDOM giveth life to them that have it. (Ecclesiastes 7:12)
    ...the ISLES shall wait for his law (Isaiah 42:4)
    https://philippinesinprophecies.wordpress.com/

  • #2
    Point?
    If it weren't for the Resurrection of Jesus, we'd all be in DEEP TROUBLE!

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Christianbookworm View Post
      Point?
      Well, Israel will not turn to God, not until the Gentile nation will rebuild them.

      And secondly, and most important, a person that does not know this prophesy implies being in the state of blindness.
      ...WISDOM giveth life to them that have it. (Ecclesiastes 7:12)
      ...the ISLES shall wait for his law (Isaiah 42:4)
      https://philippinesinprophecies.wordpress.com/

      Comment


      • #4
        Uhhh... idk.
        If it weren't for the Resurrection of Jesus, we'd all be in DEEP TROUBLE!

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Christianbookworm View Post
          Uhhh... idk.
          Well, as a christian believer, you have to know. This is crucial to your salvation.
          ...WISDOM giveth life to them that have it. (Ecclesiastes 7:12)
          ...the ISLES shall wait for his law (Isaiah 42:4)
          https://philippinesinprophecies.wordpress.com/

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by FarEastBird View Post
            Well, as a christian believer, you have to know. This is crucial to your salvation.
            No, it isn't. Jesus being fully God and fully man and rising from the dead is. Not the gospel being told to the gentiles after the Jews rejected it. What are your credentials anyway? You sure don't sound like a scholar or theologian to me. You hardly even make sense!
            If it weren't for the Resurrection of Jesus, we'd all be in DEEP TROUBLE!

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Christianbookworm View Post
              No, it isn't. Jesus being fully God and fully man and rising from the dead is. Not the gospel being told to the gentiles after the Jews rejected it. What are your credentials anyway? You sure don't sound like a scholar or theologian to me. You hardly even make sense!
              Don't focus on me, read what the bible say.

              Anyways, I am not here to compete, but to speak of what I know to have a discussion.
              ...WISDOM giveth life to them that have it. (Ecclesiastes 7:12)
              ...the ISLES shall wait for his law (Isaiah 42:4)
              https://philippinesinprophecies.wordpress.com/

              Comment


              • #8
                Hmm... nowhere did it say you have to understand prophecies to be a believer. Considering that the Bible was written in a different time and culture, knowing the context is important. Again, the Resurrection and nature of Jesus is the bare minimum for salvation.
                If it weren't for the Resurrection of Jesus, we'd all be in DEEP TROUBLE!

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Christianbookworm View Post
                  Hmm... nowhere did it say you have to understand prophecies to be a believer. Considering that the Bible was written in a different time and culture, knowing the context is important. Again, the Resurrection and nature of Jesus is the bare minimum for salvation.
                  I guess you do not understand, indeed, the deep implication of what the prophesy is saying. What the prophesy implies is that you should not believe any man except when these gentile people will come; they will be the one to rebuild the fallen tabernacle of David.
                  ...WISDOM giveth life to them that have it. (Ecclesiastes 7:12)
                  ...the ISLES shall wait for his law (Isaiah 42:4)
                  https://philippinesinprophecies.wordpress.com/

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I understand. I understand that you have no idea what you are talking about. Again, why should I believe some random internet person over the Word of God?
                    If it weren't for the Resurrection of Jesus, we'd all be in DEEP TROUBLE!

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Christianbookworm View Post
                      I understand. I understand that you have no idea what you are talking about. Again, why should I believe some random internet person over the Word of God?
                      Why not tell me where I fail, and be good christian who is willing to educate, rather than to look down on people? Will not this be fair enough to ask from a man of God? I will appreciate your kind response.
                      ...WISDOM giveth life to them that have it. (Ecclesiastes 7:12)
                      ...the ISLES shall wait for his law (Isaiah 42:4)
                      https://philippinesinprophecies.wordpress.com/

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        I've noticed that others have tried to educate you on other threads, but you have not listened. There may be language barrier issues. I presume you aren't a native English speaker? Where you fail is putting too much emphasis on things that aren't important for salvation.
                        If it weren't for the Resurrection of Jesus, we'd all be in DEEP TROUBLE!

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Christianbookworm View Post
                          I've noticed that others have tried to educate you on other threads, but you have not listened. There may be language barrier issues. I presume you aren't a native English speaker? Where you fail is putting too much emphasis on things that aren't important for salvation.
                          First, if you meant to educate me is to agree with your belief, then I guess you need to do a better persuasive explanations. Obviously, unsound behavior will not help me.

                          Just to be honest, why do I to take my effort in these things, in here, regardless I have my weakness, if I am not sincere? We believe our lives hang on our belief so we strive to be more sure.

                          Now, I wonder why would seem to say that the OP is not important in salvation when understanding the prophecy, that if it is not yet fulfilled, would mean that we are blind. So, Where did you get your knowledge of truth?
                          ...WISDOM giveth life to them that have it. (Ecclesiastes 7:12)
                          ...the ISLES shall wait for his law (Isaiah 42:4)
                          https://philippinesinprophecies.wordpress.com/

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            From scripture. From scholars and researchers that know what they are doing. I'm in agreement with the folks that were talking to you on the other thread, CP and the others. From contextual studies. From books about the culture.
                            If it weren't for the Resurrection of Jesus, we'd all be in DEEP TROUBLE!

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Christianbookworm View Post
                              From scripture. From scholars and researchers that know what they are doing. I'm in agreement with the folks that were talking to you on the other thread, CP and the others. From contextual studies. From books about the culture.
                              If that is the kind of persuasion you make then you are utterly failing. Haven't you ever read what Christ said?

                              "I thank thee, O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that thou hast hid these things from the wise and prudent, and hast revealed them unto babes: even so, Father; for so it seemed good in thy sight."

                              If your doctrines are of the truth, it will be revealed. God does not send scholars who cannot defend themselves...unless they preach deceptions, like the Devil. The Devil works by deception.

                              Isn't God who send people to reveal his word, and Himself is the one who choose whom to reveal Himself? I understand that scholars and researchers are smart people, but it does not mean that they will be right. Neither being silent will make them right.
                              ...WISDOM giveth life to them that have it. (Ecclesiastes 7:12)
                              ...the ISLES shall wait for his law (Isaiah 42:4)
                              https://philippinesinprophecies.wordpress.com/

                              Comment

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