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Chiefsinners Subduing Creation derail

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  • Chiefsinners Subduing Creation derail

    Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
    Start one. Or find somebody who can.
    Amazon started online. Now they have brick and mortar outlets too. The reverse can work too. In fact, TWeb is a kind of virtual church. Nothing is not replicable in the online version.

  • #2
    Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
    Start one. Or find somebody who can.
    Amazon began as an online organization, now they are present in brick and mortar too. Even churches can do this, everything can be offered online. TWeb is already a type of church.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Thoughtful Monk View Post
      I'm splitting this out the 2 1/2 minute video thread lest I get Cow Poked.



      In the thread, I said if I did a video it would be "I'm Saved. Now What?" As I think about it, I'm not sure what I would even put into that video. The answer I've picked up over the years seems to be "Go keep doing what you're doing and just add a church attendance, prayer, and Bible Study to your life." That seems woefully inadequate to me and also seems to ignore many verses like Luke 14:26: "If anyone comes to me and does not hate father and mother, wife and children, brothers and sisters - yes, even their own life - such a person cannot be my disciple."

      I'm at a loss on this. What points would you put into the video?
      Saved from what? And how do you know that you have been saved?


      The video should not only ask questions (any fool can ask questions that even a genius cannot answer), but also provide answers. First, you can confirm if a person is saved by his ability to subdue creation. Which depends on if he has entered rest. Which in turn depends on if he has passed testing if his faith is real. In turn depending on if he has a different spirit. In turn, on if he has seen God’s great works. In turn on if he has been told that he must agree with what Jesus taught, that he can subdue creation if he has the ability to be rescued from danger, even death if he believes God can rescue him when he puts himself in danger before creation. Which agreement needs to be proved to be true by obeying God’s voice to face danger, in Jesus’s time, by leaving worldly things like father, mother, home, property etc.

      Second, if the person is confirmed to have the ability to subdue creation, then we know that he has been saved, restored to Adam’s original status.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Chiefsinner View Post
        S.... First, you can confirm if a person is saved by his ability to subdue creation. ....
        "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
          Agreed.... I have no clue. He seems to be trying to sound smart by putting big words together.
          If it weren't for the Resurrection of Jesus, we'd all be in DEEP TROUBLE!

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Christianbookworm View Post
            Agreed.... I have no clue. He seems to be trying to sound smart by putting big words together.
            sounds like Word of Faith stuff to me.

            Comment


            • #7
              Well in another thread, he claimed the Holy Spirit was like a Green Lantern ring battery....
              If it weren't for the Resurrection of Jesus, we'd all be in DEEP TROUBLE!

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                Why did forgetting lead to not being allowed to enter Rest?


                Psalm 78:11
                They forgot what He had done, the wonders He had shown them.

                Psalm 106:7
                Our fathers in Egypt did not grasp Your wonders or remember Your abundant kindness; but they rebelled by the sea, there at the Red Sea.

                Psalm 106:13
                Yet they soon forgot His works and failed to wait for His counsel.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Chiefsinner View Post
                  Why did forgetting lead to not being allowed to enter Rest?


                  Psalm 78:11
                  They forgot what He had done, the wonders He had shown them.

                  Psalm 106:7
                  Our fathers in Egypt did not grasp Your wonders or remember Your abundant kindness; but they rebelled by the sea, there at the Red Sea.

                  Psalm 106:13
                  Yet they soon forgot His works and failed to wait for His counsel.
                  You will have to explain better than throwing some random verses out.

                  What do you mean by
                  Originally posted by Chiefsinner
                  First, you can confirm if a person is saved by his ability to subdue creation. Which depends on if he has entered rest. Which in turn depends on if he has passed testing if his faith is real. In turn depending on if he has a different spirit. In turn, on if he has seen God’s great works. In turn on if he has been told that he must agree with what Jesus taught, that he can subdue creation if he has the ability to be rescued from danger, even death if he believes God can rescue him when he puts himself in danger before creation. Which agreement needs to be proved to be true by obeying God’s voice to face danger, in Jesus’s time, by leaving worldly things like father, mother, home, property etc.
                  What do you mean by subdue creation? and 'has the ability to be rescued from danger, even death'?

                  Go into detail as if you were explaining to a child. I am confused.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Sparko View Post
                    You will have to explain better than throwing some random verses out.

                    What do you mean by


                    What do you mean by subdue creation? and 'has the ability to be rescued from danger, even death'?

                    Go into detail as if you were explaining to a child. I am confused.

                    If we answer the question related to a part of the idea, we will understand the main idea.

                    Can we consider that the Promised Land, Rest, is a type, representation of the promise to Abraham, about his descendants definitely being blessings to the world?

                    Can we consider that those who are considered descendants will be identified by faith, confidence, like Abraham had?

                    Can we consider that Israel failed to match up to that requirement?

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Chiefsinner View Post
                      Why did forgetting lead to not being allowed to enter Rest?


                      Psalm 78:11
                      They forgot what He had done, the wonders He had shown them.

                      Psalm 106:7
                      Our fathers in Egypt did not grasp Your wonders or remember Your abundant kindness; but they rebelled by the sea, there at the Red Sea.

                      Psalm 106:13
                      Yet they soon forgot His works and failed to wait for His counsel.
                      Ya know, it's called "New Testament Christianity" for a reason. The OT is wonderful, and valid, and alive and well, and real --- but we live in a whole new age.
                      "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                        Ya know, it's called "New Testament Christianity" for a reason. The OT is wonderful, and valid, and alive and well, and real --- but we live in a whole new age.
                        The point is that the OT gives guidance for what to do, when that which was promised to Abraham in Hebrews 11, but which was not received finally became available:

                        Hebrews 11:39And all these, having gained approval through their faith, did not receive what was promised, 40because God had provided something better for us, so that apart from us they would not be made perfect.

                        1 Corinthians 10:11 Now all these things happened unto them for ensamples: and they are written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the world are come.

                        What did Jesus mean when he said:

                        John 3:10“You are Israel’s teacher,” said Jesus, “and do you not understand these things?

                        Jesus is referring to midrash, an interpretational method which Jewish scholars use, where a pattern is seen in Scripture which describes a biblical process. This pattern is seen in the narratives of Abraham, Caleb, Jesus and Peter. It consists of a person being born again, having a different mindset after experiencing a revelation, having an epiphany, a change of mind, meta noia, the correct translation of repentance, about what God wants.

                        Numbers 14:24"But My servant Caleb, because he has had a different spirit and has followed Me fully, I will bring into the land which he entered, and his descendants shall take possession of it.

                        We see that because Caleb has been born again, he can see the Kingdom of God, can enter the Kingdom of God.

                        Caleb saw God’s great works, being saved from thirst and hunger in the wilderness, and concluded God wanted him to experience hardship, danger from the Amalekite/Canaanite army, so that when he was rescued (the armies defeated like grass licked up by cattle), the world (Rahab) would be drawn to God.

                        Abraham saw God’s great works (rescue from Abhimelech and Pharoah), and concluded God wanted him to experience hardship (Isaac’s death), so that when he was rescued (Isaac returned), the world would be drawn to God.

                        Jesus saw God’s great works (being saved from thirst and hunger in the wilderness), and concluded God wanted him to experience hardship (the cross), so that when he was raised (His resurrection), the world would be drawn to God.

                        Peter saw God’s great works (God’s rescue when Jesus picked up a cross every day) , and concluded God wanted him to experience hardship (leaving all his possessions), so that when he was rescued (the Father was pleased to give the Kingdom to His little flock), the world would be drawn to God.

                        Luke 18:28Peter said, “Behold, we have left our own homes and followed You.” 29And He said to them, “Truly I say to you, there is no one who has left house or wife or brothers or parents or children, for the sake of the kingdom of God, 30who will not receive many times as much at this time and in the age to come, eternal life.”

                        So repentance is changing your mind, meta noia, from thinking we can become blessings to the world by ourselves, and understanding it is by picking up a cross, so that when we are raised up, the world will be drawn to God.

                        Jesus was telling Nicodemus that if he wanted to see and enter the Promised Land, become a blessing to the world, he needed to have Caleb's experience, receive revelations of God's rescuing power.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Chiefsinner View Post
                          The point is that the OT gives guidance for what to do, when that which was promised to Abraham in Hebrews 11, but which was not received finally became available:

                          Hebrews 11:39And all these, having gained approval through their faith, did not receive what was promised, 40because God had provided something better for us, so that apart from us they would not be made perfect.

                          1 Corinthians 10:11 Now all these things happened unto them for ensamples: and they are written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the world are come.

                          What did Jesus mean when he said:

                          John 3:10“You are Israel’s teacher,” said Jesus, “and do you not understand these things?

                          Jesus is referring to midrash, an interpretational method which Jewish scholars use, where a pattern is seen in Scripture which describes a biblical process. This pattern is seen in the narratives of Abraham, Caleb, Jesus and Peter. It consists of a person being born again, having a different mindset after experiencing a revelation, having an epiphany, a change of mind, meta noia, the correct translation of repentance, about what God wants.

                          Numbers 14:24"But My servant Caleb, because he has had a different spirit and has followed Me fully, I will bring into the land which he entered, and his descendants shall take possession of it.

                          We see that because Caleb has been born again, he can see the Kingdom of God, can enter the Kingdom of God.

                          Caleb saw God’s great works, being saved from thirst and hunger in the wilderness, and concluded God wanted him to experience hardship, danger from the Amalekite/Canaanite army, so that when he was rescued (the armies defeated like grass licked up by cattle), the world (Rahab) would be drawn to God.

                          Abraham saw God’s great works (rescue from Abhimelech and Pharoah), and concluded God wanted him to experience hardship (Isaac’s death), so that when he was rescued (Isaac returned), the world would be drawn to God.

                          Jesus saw God’s great works (being saved from thirst and hunger in the wilderness), and concluded God wanted him to experience hardship (the cross), so that when he was raised (His resurrection), the world would be drawn to God.

                          Peter saw God’s great works (God’s rescue when Jesus picked up a cross every day) , and concluded God wanted him to experience hardship (leaving all his possessions), so that when he was rescued (the Father was pleased to give the Kingdom to His little flock), the world would be drawn to God.

                          Luke 18:28Peter said, “Behold, we have left our own homes and followed You.” 29And He said to them, “Truly I say to you, there is no one who has left house or wife or brothers or parents or children, for the sake of the kingdom of God, 30who will not receive many times as much at this time and in the age to come, eternal life.”

                          So repentance is changing your mind, meta noia, from thinking we can become blessings to the world by ourselves, and understanding it is by picking up a cross, so that when we are raised up, the world will be drawn to God.

                          Jesus was telling Nicodemus that if he wanted to see and enter the Promised Land, become a blessing to the world, he needed to have Caleb's experience, receive revelations of God's rescuing power.
                          When you're dealing with a new Christian, you really need to be very practical and "step by step". Keeping it simple is a huge plus.
                          "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                            When you're dealing with a new Christian, you really need to be very practical and "step by step". Keeping it simple is a huge plus.
                            Sparko said, "Explain it in detail so even a child can understand".

                            Second, when Paul said, "Believe in the Lord Jesus and you will be saved", he meant believe in the message Jesus gave, which is "The salvation leading to be blessings to the world, as well as solving your personal problems, can be received if you are able to pick up a cross, and be raised up, drawing the whole world to God".

                            Luke 18:29“Truly I tell you,” Jesus replied, “no one who has left home or wife or brothers or parents or children for the sake of the kingdom of God 30will fail to receive many times more at the proper time— and in the age to come, eternal life.”

                            The Age to Come is when you enter Rest. Caleb entered the Promised Land, but there was a Rest yet to be entered, the Body of Christ, the New Humanity in Christ.
                            Last edited by footwasher; 08-29-2020, 03:12 AM.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Chiefsinner View Post
                              Sparko said, "Explain it in detail so even a child can understand".
                              Because you seem to have the gift of babble. You seem to use a lot of words ans scriptures in a way that doesn't really get a cogent point across.

                              When you're dealing with a new Christian, they often have no biblical foundation, so simply supplying a stream of unrelated scripture verses is not what they need.
                              "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

                              Comment

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