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Are the verses in the Quran about self-defense or about unprovoked attack on J/C?

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  • Are the verses in the Quran about self-defense or about unprovoked attack on J/C?

    Are the verses in the Quran about self-defense or about unprovoked attack on Jews and Christians?

    I am a Christian and I believe that Israel has a new covenant in Yeshua Messiah.

    I believe that the verses in question (sorry I do not have a reference or the references, I am not well versed in the Quran I have only read it over fifteen years ago) might be about self-defense rather than unprovoked attack.

    Thoughts? Proofs?

  • #2
    My thoughts are about laying down our rights rather than self-defense or attacking others. And, understanding if in God's eyes we have these rights anyhow.

    Who are the people of the book? Christians?

    Comment


    • #3
      John 14:27 KJV - Peace I leave with you, my peace I give unto you: not as the world giveth, give I unto you. Let not your heart be troubled, neither let it be afraid.

      John 14:27 NASB20 - "Peace I leave you, My peace I give you; not as the world gives, do I give to you. Do not let your hearts be troubled, nor fearful.

      Comment


      • #4
        My understanding is that Islam promotes itself as a religion of peace. Is the word religion used by Muslims or adherents of Islam? Does Islam mean the way of peace?

        Comment


        • #5
          Islam has been quite happy to following the commands of Muhammad to spread his message at the point of the sword. OTOH, while Christians have often shown a willingness to do the same, unlike Muslims who have been commanded to convert by force, doing so flies in the face of what Christ commands.

          Basically, for a Muslim to refuse to use force is disobeying Muhammad while a Christian using force is disobeying Jesus.


          And just to head off the obvious objection, all of the ayats in the qur'an calling for peaceful co-existence have been abrogated by later commands to forcibly convert.

          I'm always still in trouble again

          "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
          "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
          "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
            Islam has been quite happy to following the commands of Muhammad to spread his message at the point of the sword. OTOH, while Christians have often shown a willingness to do the same, unlike Muslims who have been commanded to convert by force, doing so flies in the face of what Christ commands.

            Basically, for a Muslim to refuse to use force is disobeying Muhammad while a Christian using force is disobeying Jesus.


            And just to head off the obvious objection, all of the ayats in the qur'an calling for peaceful co-existence have been abrogated by later commands to forcibly convert.
            Do you know what you are talking about when you mention forcible conversion? Is that from the Quran and do you have an example that we can examine?

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by JacobMartinMertens View Post

              Do you know what you are talking about when you mention forcible conversion? Is that from the Quran and do you have an example that we can examine?
              I guess you could take a look at this thread and decide for yourself.

              I'm always still in trouble again

              "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
              "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
              "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
                I guess you could take a look at this thread and decide for yourself.
                I have read the first two posts where you outlined what you wanted to say for the thread. I am reminded of 1 Corinthians 13 and God's love for individuals and the nations. As for Islam, I don't know if it is a religion. Thank you for sharing what you have. I have only read the Quran but in English as I do not know Arabic.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by JacobMartinMertens View Post

                  I have read the first two posts where you outlined what you wanted to say for the thread. I am reminded of 1 Corinthians 13 and God's love for individuals and the nations. As for Islam, I don't know if it is a religion. Thank you for sharing what you have. I have only read the Quran but in English as I do not know Arabic.
                  You... "don't know if [Islam] is a religion"? What else do you think it might be?

                  I'm always still in trouble again

                  "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                  "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
                  "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
                    You... "don't know if [Islam] is a religion"? What else do you think it might be?
                    A way. That is how I understand it. But I don't know if the Quran speaks otherwise.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by JacobMartinMertens View Post

                      A way. That is how I understand it. But I don't know if the Quran speaks otherwise.
                      It might be wise to do a bit of basic research which would likely answer several of your questions.

                      I'm always still in trouble again

                      "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                      "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
                      "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
                        It might be wise to do a bit of basic research which would likely answer several of your questions.
                        Thank you. I know that everyone is to be responsible for their own sins, and rewarded for their own righteousness. But there are also influences and for example, the sins of the fathers. With Mohammed I would want to evaluate him based on his own words and if he was influenced.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
                          It might be wise to do a bit of basic research which would likely answer several of your questions.
                          I have done some research. Thank you for suggesting this. If one is balanced in how they view things research can only help a person to understand better the world in which they live. I did a Google Search and read some about Islam.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by JacobMartinMertens View Post
                            My understanding is that Islam promotes itself as a religion of peace. Is the word religion used by Muslims or adherents of Islam? Does Islam mean the way of peace?
                            Islam means "submission"

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Sparko View Post

                              Islam means "submission"
                              In my interactions with Muslims they have not said this. I HAVE seen it before.

                              Comment

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