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Cogito ergo sum

Here in the Philosophy forum we will talk about all the "why" questions. We'll have conversations about the way in which philosophy and theology and religion interact with each other. Metaphysics, ontology, origins, truth? They're all fair game so jump right in and have some fun! But remember...play nice!

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Is time physical?

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  • shunyadragon
    replied
    Originally posted by seer View Post

    No Shuny, Einstein believed that time was an illusion, that the past, present and future all exist together, that is block theory. That was Einstein's interpretation of his theory...
    No Einstein did not say time is an illusion. He describes time as a continuum and because of the relative nature of time our perception of the past, present, and future is an illusion.
    Last edited by shunyadragon; 09-28-2022, 10:25 AM.

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  • shunyadragon
    replied
    Originally posted by Sparko View Post

    Please explain what you think the B-theory of time is and how it works. Thanks.
    See post #506

    Leave a comment:


  • seer
    replied
    Originally posted by Sparko View Post

    He never said time was an illusion. He claimed it was a physical dimension, that space and time are the same thing, but in 4 different dimensions. Space-time is height, width, depth and time.
    I was speaking of our experience of the flow of time, i.e. the distinction between past, present, future. Like I said in post 502...

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  • Sparko
    replied
    Originally posted by seer View Post

    No Shuny, Einstein believed that time was an illusion, that the past, present and future all exist together, that is block theory. That was Einstein's interpretation of his theory...
    He never said time was an illusion. He claimed it was a physical dimension, that space and time are the same thing, but in 4 different dimensions. Space-time is height, width, depth and time.

    Leave a comment:


  • seer
    replied
    Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post

    The two different 'block?' theories are a later subjective philosophical interpretation of Einstein's Theory
    No Shuny, Einstein believed that time was an illusion, that the past, present and future all exist together, that is block theory. That was Einstein's interpretation of his theory...

    Leave a comment:


  • shunyadragon
    replied
    [QUOTE=seer;n1417646]

    Einstein said our view of the flow or passage of time was an illusion, that is Block theory. p/quote]

    The two different 'block?' theories are a later subjective philosophical interpretation of Einstein's Theory

    Both A and B theory theoriese are philosophical interpretations from the human perspective.

    Source: https://search.yahoo.com/search?fr=mcafee&type=E211US1494G0&p=b+theory+of+time



    B-theory of time
    Philosophical theory in which the flow of time is only a subjective illusion of human consciousness and that the past, present and future are equally real, without ontological privileging of the present

    The B-theory of time, also called the "tenseless theory of time", is one of two positions regarding the temporal ordering of events in the philosophy of time. B-theorists argue that the flow of time is only a subjective illusion of human consciousness, that the past, present, and future are equally real, and that time is tenseless: temporal becoming is not an objective feature of reality. Therefore... Wikipedia

    © Copyright Original Source



    Scientists likely prefer the B theory of time, because of the relative nature of time.

    Source: www.amnh.org/exhibitions/einstein/[B

    time[/B]/a-matter-of-time]

    • In the Special Theory of Relativity, Einstein determined that time is relative—in other words, the rate at which time passes depends on your frame of reference. Just as observers in two different frames of reference don't always agree on how to describe the motion of a bouncing ball, they also don't always agree on when an event happened or how long it took.

    © Copyright Original Source

    Last edited by shunyadragon; 09-28-2022, 09:05 AM.

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  • shunyadragon
    replied
    Originally posted by seer View Post

    Totally has nothing to do with my point or the discussion.
    I responded to the post nothing less nor nothing more.

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  • Sparko
    replied
    Originally posted by seer View Post

    Totally has nothing to do with my point or the discussion.
    That's pretty much any Shuny post. I think he has been replaced by a malfunctioning AI text bot.

    Leave a comment:


  • seer
    replied
    Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post

    By the evidence Natural Laws and natural processes underlie the nature of our physical existence. The question of 'What is running the film' is a subjective anthropomorphic projection of 'something' that there is no evidence that exists.

    At present our physical existence simply exists as observed.
    Totally has nothing to do with my point or the discussion.

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  • seer
    replied
    Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post

    I believe that what you are calling 'block theory? (growing block theory?)' needs more explanation and misrepresents Einstein's Theory of special relativity. It sort of states the obvious of the limits of our comprehension of the passage of time, and makes a philosophical theory that is not meaningful. It is more a subjective philosophical human perspective including the alternatives: eternalism (block universe theory) and presentism. They often appeal to human issues of comprehension such as common sense, but in reality they are not meaningful from the scientific perspective. Einstein never proposed his theory in terms of 'block time,' eternalism nor presentism.'

    Measuring time and space is a human construct, and in reality there are no units of measurement naturally on time and space.
    Einstein said our view of the flow or passage of time was an illusion, that is Block theory.


    In Albert Einstein’s theory of relativity, for example, time is woven together with the three dimensions of space, forming a bendy, four-dimensional space-time continuum—a “block universe” encompassing the entire past, present, and future. Einstein’s equations portray everything in the block universe as decided from the beginning; the initial conditions of the cosmos determine what comes later, and surprises do not occur—they only seem to. “For us believing physicists,” Einstein wrote in 1955, weeks before his death, “the distinction between past, present and future is only a stubbornly persistent illusion.”

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  • shunyadragon
    replied
    Originally posted by seer View Post

    What is running the film in B theory? And you can only actually run that film if A theory is correct - any series of events in motion would require flow.
    By the evidence Natural Laws and natural processes underlie the nature of our physical existence. The question of 'What is running the film' is a subjective anthropomorphic projection of 'something' that there is no evidence that exists.

    At present our physical existence simply exists as observed.

    Leave a comment:


  • Sparko
    replied
    Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post

    I believe that what is called 'block theory misrepresents Einstein's Theory of special relativity. It sort of states the obvious of our limits our comprehension of the passage of time, and makes a theory is not meaningful. It is more a philosophical human perspective including the alternatives: eternalism and presentism. They often appeal to human issues of comprehension such as common sense, but in reality they are not meaningful from the scientific perspective. Einstein never proposed his theory in terms of 'block time,' eternalism nor presentism.'
    Please explain what you think the B-theory of time is and how it works. Thanks.

    Leave a comment:


  • shunyadragon
    replied
    Originally posted by seer View Post

    Block theory comes out of Einstein's theory of special relativity. That past, present and future exist together. And our view of passing time (or flow) is an illusion.
    I believe that what you are calling 'block theory? (growing block theory?)' needs more explanation and misrepresents Einstein's Theory of special relativity. It sort of states the obvious of the limits of our comprehension of the passage of time, and makes a philosophical theory that is not meaningful. It is more a subjective philosophical human perspective including the alternatives: eternalism (block universe theory) and presentism. They often appeal to human issues of comprehension such as common sense, but in reality they are not meaningful from the scientific perspective. Einstein never proposed his theory in terms of 'block time,' eternalism nor presentism.'

    Measuring time and space is a human construct, and in reality there are no units of measurement naturally on time and space.
    Last edited by shunyadragon; 09-28-2022, 07:53 AM.

    Leave a comment:


  • seer
    replied
    Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post

    This 'block' concept (Newtonian view of Nature?) needs explanation, because it has no relationship to the objectively verifiable evidence that supports the Methodological Naturalism the undermines all of science.
    Block theory comes out of Einstein's theory of special relativity. That past, present and future exist together. And our view of passing time (or flow) is an illusion.

    Leave a comment:


  • shunyadragon
    replied
    Originally posted by Machinist View Post
    Seer mentioned before you even became self aware...before we are even conceived, everything is already written in the block universe.

    That makes it a little questionable now. A person can not exist because they haven't been born yet, nor will they for thousands of years, and in the same block, they have been dead for thousands of years.

    It's troubling to think that people who have not even been born, actually have already made all the decisions they will ever make and it's all recorded in the future block.
    This 'block' concept (Newtonian view of Nature?) needs explanation, because it has no relationship to the objectively verifiable evidence that supports the Methodological Naturalism the undermines all of science.

    Leave a comment:

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