"absolute free speech"

[Cow Poke]

They put all their hopes on Pearl Harbor not only crushing the American naval presence in the Pacific but sapping any will to fight.

Boy did they miscalculate.

"Hey Bubba, hold my saki while I whop this big ol' hornet nest with a stick".

[tabibito]

They put all their hopes on Pearl Harbor not only crushing the American naval presence in the Pacific but sapping any will to fight.

Boy did they miscalculate.

They had to split their forces between Pearl Harbour and Singapore. That made a major difference - note the date (1941) when they were confident that they couldn't win. What year did they attack Pearl Harbour?

[Machinist]

It wasn't exactly an eye for an eye. Was it? What do you think? How do you justify dropping two nukes on Japan because they attacked a Naval field?

I suppose they war would have dragged on indefinitely if America didn't drop those bombs, but I think HA's objection could be the seemingly disproportionate retaliation.

[rogue06]

They had to split their forces between Pearl Harbour and Singapore. That made a major difference - note the date (1941) when they were confident that they couldn't win. What year did they attack Pearl Harbour?

December 7, 1941. "A date which will live in infamy." That was before their attack on Singapore (which was nearly two months later in February of 42).

And its Pearl Harbor. We don't waste our time on superfluous vowels.

[Hypatia_Alexandria]

You mean like when you post a "study" that is nothing more than a survey?
Or a book on Germany by an liberal ASSOCIATE professor of a leftst university?
Or another book buy some unknown sociology professor from JAMAICA about how racist the US is?

You are the very textbook definiton of "confirmation bias".

Google that.

You appear to dismiss the academic credibility of anyone who does not share your own personal political viewpoint.

[Cow Poke]

You appear to dismiss the academic credibility of anyone who does not share your own personal political viewpoint.

No, I specifically dismiss the academic crediblity of, for example, the Jamaican sociologist you chose simply because he wrote something that supports your confirmation bias.

Proof that you do this often is your need to try to cover your ignorance with "ask the author".

Stop posting stupid stuff.

[tabibito]

December 7, 1941. "A date which will live in infamy." That was before their attack on Singapore (which was nearly two months later in February of 42).

How long - how many hours before Pearl HarbOr- had the Japanese ambassador been kept waiting at the President's door (so to speak) with the formal declaration of war in his hand - and prevented from delivering that declaration? Do you think that the American government was unaware of what the Japanese ambassador was waiting to do?

Singapore you were right ... The actual British Empire targets in 1941 were Hong Kong, Malaya (now Malaysia), Singapore and Burma (now Myanmar).

[Cow Poke]

How long - how many hours before Pearl HarbOr-

had the Japanese ambassador been kept waiting at the President's door (so to speak) with the formal declaration of war in his hand - and prevented from delivering that declaration? Do you think that the American government was unaware of what the Japanese ambassador was waiting to do?

I believe we'll get as clear and concise an answer on this as we will on "Who shot Kennedy".

[rogue06]

How long - how many hours before Pearl HarbOr- had the Japanese ambassador been kept waiting at the President's door (so to speak) with the formal declaration of war in his hand - and prevented from delivering that declaration? Do you think that the American government was unaware of what the Japanese ambassador was waiting to do?

Um, from a 1996 NYT article:

Source: Japan Admits It Bungled Notice of War in '41

After decades of obfuscation, Japan stated today for the first time that bungling within the Foreign Ministry 53 years ago was responsible for Japan's failure to declare war on the United States before launching its attack on Pearl Harbor.

The acknowledgement came in documents that were released to clear the air on outstanding questions from the war in advance of the 50th anniversary of Japan's surrender, next Aug. 15. But the documents are unlikely to resolve the basic issue: why Japan acted as it did.

The attack on Honolulu, which was a total surprise, was regarded by Washington as treachery. The Japanese killed 2,348 Americans and destroyed 188 planes and 19 warships, a crippling blow. President Franklin D. Roosevelt declared war the next day.

American anger has long focused on the fact that the attack, on Dec. 7, 1941, came during talks on disputes over Tokyo's expansionist policies.

Well after the attack began, the Japanese Embassy in Washington delivered a statement ending the negotiations, a virtual declaration of war, and the newly released documents paint a picture of bureaucratic missteps that caused the delay.

Misoji Yabunaka, general affairs manager of the Foreign Ministry, was quoted here Sunday as saying the problem resulted from a broader misunderstanding between the Ministry and the embassy.

"The latest review of the documents revealed that they were not the only ones responsible," he said of the embassy officials. "There also were differences of understanding between the Foreign Ministry and the Japanese Embassy there. In that sense, the entire Foreign Ministry was responsible for the problem."

These questions are still sensitive.

Many Japanese feel that Japan was forced to launch the war because of an American embargo, and that the way the war ended, with the horrific atomic bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki, was unjustified.

Many Americans regard the brutality of the atomic bombings as legitimate because of the treachery of the attack on Pearl Harbor.

The documents released today show that the memo declaring an end to the bilateral talks was supposed to have been delivered to Secretary of State Cordell Hull by 1 P.M. on Dec. 7, about 25 minutes before the attack began; this fact has long been known. The note was actually delivered about 1 hour and 20 minutes after the attack began.

According to the ministry, the memo was sent electronically to the embassy late on Dec. 6, after the junior diplomat on duty had gone home. The diplomat was Shozo Okumura, a first secretary.

The memo was decoded by noon on Dec. 7, but diplomats took until well past the attack hour before delivering it.

The documents did not address the question of why such an important document was not handled with greater urgency, nor the more obvious concern of whether the bungling was deliberate so the attack at Pearl Harbor would come off successfully.


Source

© Copyright Original Source

So the answer is none.

[tabibito]

I believe we'll get as clear and concise an answer on this as we will on "Who shot Kennedy".

Double checking, yes. The intention was to have it delivered prior to the attack - and it would have been if the Japanese had actually decoded the document in time. The date was a problem ... Monday for the attack, but Sunday in the US, so the embassy was short staffed account the usual Sunday holiday.

[rogue06]

Double checking, yes. The intention was to have it delivered prior to the attack - and it would have been if the Japanese had actually decoded the document in time. The date was a problem ... Monday for the attack, but Sunday in the US, so the embassy was short staffed account the usual Sunday holiday.

IOW, the Japanese were never kept waiting as has been often falsely claimed.

[tabibito]

Um, from a 1996 NYT article:

Many Japanese feel that Japan was forced to launch the war because of an American embargo, and that the way the war ended, with the horrific atomic bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki, was unjustified.

Facts: the embargo was not only on oil, though that was the major issue. Pearl Harbor was the base for the fleet imposing embargoes on Japan, which means that America was taking military action against Japan long before Pearl Harbor ... and without any declaration of war in place. Late 1940/early 1941, all players - Japan, America, British Empire were fully aware that Japan was being pushed into war.

Many Americans regard the brutality of the atomic bombings as legitimate because of the treachery of the attack on Pearl Harbor.

The bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki deliberately targetted civilian populations, as had prior fire bombing throughout Honshu at least (not sure about Kyushu and Hokkaido). The primary victims of fire-bombing were infants and young children, infirm, and elderly, and property - justifiable action against civilians in retaliation for an attack on a military target, and AFTER Japan had already made an offer of surrender that would have met with acceptance had it been made by a European nation in roughly similar circumstances.

World War II had no white hats - some were just a slightly off-black shade of grey.

ETA forgot to mention. Hiroshima was the centre for the strongest opposition (largely Christian) to the war.

[tabibito]

IOW, the Japanese were never kept waiting as has been often falsely claimed.

That is true.

[rogue06]

Facts: the embargo was not only on oil, though that was the major issue. Pearl Harbor was the base for the fleet imposing embargoes on Japan, which means that America was taking military action against Japan long before Pearl Harbor ... and without any declaration of war in place. Late 1940/early 1941, all players - Japan, America, British Empire were fully aware that Japan was being pushed into war.



The bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki deliberately targetted civilian populations, as had prior fire bombing throughout Honshu at least (not sure about Kyushu and Hokkaido). The primary victims of fire-bombing were infants and young children, infirm, and elderly, and property - justifiable action against civilians in retaliation for an attack on a military target, and AFTER Japan had already made an offer of surrender that would have met with acceptance had it been made by a European nation in roughly similar circumstances.

World War II had no white hats - some were just a slightly off-black shade of grey.

ETA forgot to mention. Hiroshima was the centre for the strongest opposition (largely Christian) to the war.

Hiroshima was selected because of its shipyards. The Kure Naval Arsenal there was one, if not the most important shipyard for the Imperial Japanese Navy. It was where the Yamamoto was constructed and FWICT most of their Aircraft Carriers.

Nagasaki was selected because of all the military factories located there and the Sasebo Naval District was one of the most important ports for the Imperial Japanese Navy.

Both were also selected because unlike nearly ever other major industrial center in Japan, they were largely unscathed.

So much for "deliberately targetted civilian populations" as if the massive dumps of pamphlets encouraging the people to evacuate before they were bombed hadn't already done so.

[Machinist]

Question:

Did the Japanese have ambitions of world domination like the Nazis did? If left to their own devices, would the world have had to deal with yet another power like Germany?